Author Topic: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.  (Read 8101 times)

barewirewalker

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #15 on: 11:21:56, 09/12/19 »
The one reply that really goes to the heart of the matter,
I would write to your Chief Constable and explain as above. Then ask him why his men are aiding the landowner to waste police time. Also you could demand to be charged or left alone. Send a copy of your letter to the local press. The police are there to uphold the law, not harass the innocent.
I believe I am correct in saying that the same rights apply to a PRoW as to the highway, you have every right to be there, whatever time of day. The driver, whose vehicle lights play across bedroom windows at 3 or 4 pm are not subjected to repeated visits by the police.

Do not cloud your argument with the issue of your dogs, if they are causing damage that is for the landowner to prove, you keep them under control. The landowner is at fault harassing you and has intimidated you into not being able to use these PRoWs. This is a criminal a offense. I would get professional advice on writing a letter and further to Pitboots suggestions send a copy to the Local Country Landowners Association branch and national, also the NFU.  You should state your case to the County Councils rights of way dept. and insist that your issue is discussed by the counties Local Access Forum or whatever name that statutory body now exists under.

If you go to the press the line you should adopt is; this landowner is a social bully using power and status to intimidate.

With the proviso that that the situation is as you state, I would have preferred to been able to identify the location as I am sure that others here would. Specific examples are more useful than general complaints.

+1 for what Thomasdevon says.
I think you are in the right but you are not going to win this one. Look at from the owners perspective - he sees lights, ignores them, thinking its that fellow with the dogs again. Next morning he is missing thousands of pounds of gear. If you saw suspicious lights on your property would you ignore them.


-1 for what Thomasdevon says.
If more law abiding people were about there might be more prosecutions of the right sort of felons.

As the Landowners attitude is embedded in centuries of thinking all strangers are criminals, they have been unable to develop strategies that would allow the majority of law abiding people to help combat rural crime and this is a prime example.
 
BWW
Their Land is in Our Country.

Andies

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #16 on: 11:54:33, 09/12/19 »
+1 for what Thomasdevon says.
I think you are in the right but you are not going to win this one. Look at from the owners perspective - he sees lights, ignores them, thinking its that fellow with the dogs again. Next morning he is missing thousands of pounds of gear. If you saw suspicious lights on your property would you ignore them.

Nothing wrong with the owner checking it out but why is he calling the police if he finds it's just a guy walking his dogs? We all sadly need to be safety conscious but I suspect the landowner has another agenda here.

I would check matters out thoroughly as I suggested, and assuming your within your rights to be on that footpath send a letter to the chief constable by registered post advising him that you will be exercising your right to walk the footpath whenever you chose, and that you are concerned for your welfare due to intimidation by the landowner. I thought the police had a duty of care to the public and they are now on notice?

gunwharfman

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #17 on: 12:14:05, 09/12/19 »
The following may or may not be relevant? Are you the 'wrong' colour, culture or religion for the landowner and/or the other people involved? What about being gay, trans, disabled, obese, wrong class, you wear glasses, have a hearing aid, etc, in my life and work experience some people can be very 'odd' about such things?

alan de enfield

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #18 on: 12:18:26, 09/12/19 »
……………. in my life and work experience some people can be very 'odd' about such things?


Well …………

The OP does say he is a Bare Wire Walker - maybe he is walking about naked ?

Andies

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #19 on: 12:19:57, 09/12/19 »
The following may or may not be relevant? Are you the 'wrong' colour, culture or religion for the landowner and/or the other people involved? What about being gay, trans, disabled, obese, wrong class, you wear glasses, have a hearing aid, etc, in my life and work experience some people can be very 'odd' about such things?

Sadly very true, but it's probably more serious than that he's on his land.... and they really don't like that >:(

jimbob

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #20 on: 12:34:32, 09/12/19 »

Well …………

The OP does say he is a Bare Wire Walker - maybe he is walking about naked ?
BWW can have a strange effect but the OP was Prow.
Too little, too late, too bad......

GnP

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #21 on: 12:42:53, 09/12/19 »
BWW can have a strange effect but the OP was Prow.
##
He`s been speed reading again...ha
A night under silnylon. Doesn't have the same ring to it.

barewirewalker

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #22 on: 12:45:56, 09/12/19 »

Well …………

The OP does say he is a Bare Wire Walker - maybe he is walking about naked ?
Sorry not the OP, perhaps you should read the topic from the beginning.
Just for the record. I have been posting over 15 years under this name and it has never before been connected with nakedness. I have never found from those, who walk our access network to its limits, the need to explain that it is not unusual to meet bare wire in the form of barbed, electric, high tensile or galvanized, pig or sheep netting. The use of wire is often a clue to how welcome one is a part of the countryside, a clue to the nature of husbandry practiced or its neglect.
When I first started posting on a forum, its was as a result of being verbally abused, when I was squarely on a right of way. I was curious, as an ex-farmer, why I should be subjected to rather extreme torrent of invective. My subsequent awareness has made me realise that post 2026, the landowners will push to weed out many rights of way they consider underused.

So if we do not try to understand the structure of the access network we use, walking will be left defenseless when this process starts.
BWW
Their Land is in Our Country.

Mel

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #23 on: 12:47:20, 09/12/19 »
My two-penneth’s worth for the OP’s quandary …
 
We can all try to second-guess the motives of the landowner but the top and bottom of it is it is an issue you and the landowner need to discuss like adults.  Once upon a time this would have been done over a pint in the pub but seeing as the Police have been involved, why not ask if you can have a mediation meeting with the landowner. Both sides of the story can be aired in a neutrally safe place and in a controlled manner and hopefully a workable solution/compromise can be sought.
 
Shooting your mouth off at the game keepers will achieve nothing apart from confirm that you are indeed someone they / the landowner should be wary of… and perhaps investigate…
 

andyapanel

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #24 on: 13:02:21, 09/12/19 »
Were they real police?


barewirewalker

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #25 on: 13:06:53, 09/12/19 »
In new gamekeepers outfits  8)
And the course to mediation could be through the NFU. This has been done with product disputes for many years, it would not harm this organisation to come face to face with this sort of issue, as they have side stepped the access issue, leaving it to the CLA so that the public relations between customer and producer is lost in the issue of Land Snobbery.
BWW
Their Land is in Our Country.

Dyffryn Ardudwy

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #26 on: 14:47:50, 09/12/19 »
Years ago, when i was still living in South Wales, i regularly walked a public right of way, through farming land towards friends of mine, who lived near Caerphilly.
One farmer in particular, was very confrontational and openly hostile towards people walking over his land.

I have often recounted my recollections with my friend, who knew the farmer i was talking about, and agreed that he was very set in his ways, and could be very aggressive towards members of the public.

He never involved the police or authorities, but i was always very cautious and on the lookout for him.
When your young and probably more afraid of those in authority, or who show open hostility towards you, its very unnerving.

It sounds very likely that the group of farmers who have involved the police, are just using their power and authority as land owners, to intimidate walkers using their land.

I suppose walking in the dead of night, might give them more concern, seeing a lone walker with a head torch.

My advice is to walk during the daylight hours, and if you are walking a public right of way, no amount of hostility can stop you walking on their property.

Its clear that they are using the presence of the Police to intimidate you.

No police officer, is going to bother to knock on anyones door, unless they have been told information that they feel needs investigation.

If you know that you have done nothing wrong, other than walk where these farmers do not want you to be, then continue walking.

It may be that a total fabrication of the truth has been given to the Police.

Theres intimidation by landowner, who shout, allow their aggressive dogs to get a bit too close, and show their displeasure at ramblers, and then there's people who fabricate a lot of false information, and inform the Police that a particular person was up to no good on their land.

Either way, you cannot confront these farmers, that's like a red rag to a bull.

Surely there must be other areas where you can go walking, because always being frightened of encountering certain hostile farmers is always unpleasant, and maybe unnecessary as well.
Such people are usually very set in their ways, and go so far, without actually using physical violence, and they can continue this way for many years, knowing that's enough to deter most ramblers or walkers.


Its when they over step the mark, and physically attack or willfully cause injury to walkers, that's when it can get very nasty.


Thankfully those instances are rare, but farming is a hard way of life, and it often needs a hard person to endure such a lifestyle, and with such hard physical labour required to run a farm successfully, comes a hard physical temperament.


Most farmers are well natured, but i am sure most of us here, have prior experience with a farmer or landowner who simply does not like walkers crossing his land.


For the average person, enjoying a walk in the country, it will hopefully be their only encounter with such people, they can shrug it off, and get over the unpleasantness, and think nothing of it when they get home.

The best solution, is not to go anywhere near their land, even if you have the legal right to do so.


If you can avoid their anger, and crossing their land, that's the best option.


Any wise person dislikes confrontation, if its at all possible, walk somewhere else.

pauldawes

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #27 on: 15:13:44, 09/12/19 »

The best solution, is not to go anywhere near their land, even if you have the legal right to do so.


These things are subjective...but our subjective views are poles apart on this one.


One thing I’m baffled about is “even if you have the legal right...”. Come on..given the harassment the OP has faced he will have carefully checked whether it’s a public right of way.


He’s got the legal right to walk it. And beyond that he’s got the moral right. (Not always the same thing.)The countryside should be open to all.


On the surface the farmer is acting in a selfish and bullying way. Certainly...as always..it’s worth exploring amicable solutions...but in my eyes one requirement for any solution is that the OP should be able to walk the path, without feeling threatened.

Ronin83

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #28 on: 15:23:59, 09/12/19 »
I think Thomas Devon is advocating giving in and being a victim. This just leads to those kind of people thinking they can get away with anything. I'd take a few numbers with you next time. I wouldn't back down. If you become genuinely too scared to go then fair enough, but who wants to live in fear? Screw that

andyapanel

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Re: I need advice from farmer and police harrasment.
« Reply #29 on: 15:34:17, 09/12/19 »
I agree with you, Ronin.


I have a smallholding and have faced down a Hunt more than once with all their hounds, who felt they had the right to ride over my crops, destroy my deep beds and try to kill small furry mammals in a copse on my property; it is not pleasant, but if you don't do it you will be a perpetual victim.


I know a lot of Farmers round me, and the smaller ones are fine (I don't mean they are Hobbits). The big one is just greedy( no, he is not an Ogre), but I guess that is symptomatic of some folk these days.


Come the revolution, I know who I want to put up against the wall...

 

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