I am a tight old git that would start considering whether I could lose 250g of my bodyweight (which I ought to consider anyway ::) ) rather than change what appears to be a very capable tent.
Good luck with getting back to walking.
Regards Keith
could be the 250g could be saved on other kit for a lot less money.
Without knowing what knapsack you have it is very possible you could save that weight easily for a lot less money. Me I am a believer in tight fistidness. AND for that money you could get a really good down sleeping bag which would be even more beneficial to your knees hips and back.
Well a down sleping bag will save you at least half a kilo., probably more.
Take a really good look at all that cooking gear. Maybe a small jet boil, titanium spork and a few wet wipes would do the same job? A spare lighter perhaps.
Personally I carry high energy bars and eat in pubs/ cafes. Better meals than I can cook and free use of a usually decent loo. GUNWHARFMAN is to thank for this. I copied his modus , it certainly works for me.
I want the lightest load I can afford so that I can walk easily. I am prepared to put up with discomfort, well , except for cold and hunger.
Thanks for the welcome.
I was diagnosed diabetic, overweight and with a dangerously high Cholesterol 3 years ago, I started walking again, covering 4-10 miles 5 or 6 times a week and for every pound I lost I 'added a pound weight' to my Rucksack - when, after 11 months I had 56 lbs in the sack I decided that, as an 'oldie' it was enough and started to walk 'seriously' again carrying a reasonable weight.
I am no longer classed as diabetic, have a Cholesterol of 3.5 and feel much better.
Spent the odd nights out, but now looking to do some multi-day trips.
I am not at all unhappy with my current gear but just sort of feel its time for a bit of retail therapy.
Retail therapy would be changing the rucksack and sleep system.
That's a lot of rucksack - 56 pounds is about 25 kilos - what are you carrying that weighs that much or was that till you got fit and now you've cut that weight?
Are you looking for a more minimalist pack weight?
Any weight saving has to be beneficial
My thoughts would be that if your comfortable with it that is your choice but if you can carry all of that and cut the overall weight in half or more is there any reason why you wouldn't?
None
The argument that to cary 12 kilos your legs don't notice I don't really agree with, try with 6 kilos and you will notice a difference at the end of a big walk or a bit of ascent, no matter who you are.
My 25 litre (2-3 Day sack, including tent and sleeping bag, but without food & water) comes in at 5.75kg
Some would say that has a bigger cost but if you are looking for retail therapy and have a couple of quid to spend I'd be all over that pack - I just wouldn't tell Mrs Bounder and any receipts for 'what this old thing, I've had it ages' would be well and truly binned
I am a 'Master Black Belt' in waylaying the postman / carriers. Things are becoming less difficult now SWMBO has her own Paypal account & is going wild - she purchased 5ks of nettles this week for £25. NETTLES - NETTLES as if we don't have enough of our own !!!!!
The long and the short of it for me is that I could reduce my pack weight by spending hundreds of pounds on lighter tent / sleeping bag / rucksack / clothing / other bits of equipment, but I feel it would be extravagant (I said on page 1 of this thread I'm a tight old git) and anyway I don't have that amount to spend in the first place. So, I stick with what I have for now, only looking for something lighter if a replacement is essential, or if something hugely less weight comes along that is within my budget.
is there justification for saving a few grams ?
(I'm not yet at the stage of cutting my tooth brush or comb in half, or using leaves instead of toilet paper).
I don't have any real problems with the weight (t'would be 'nicer lighter', and the day will come when it needs to be), everything 'works' I'm dry, warm, well fed and comfortable, maybe its best left as-is for now.
We may be camping but that doesn't mean we have to do without our comforts.
If you are ever driven to use leaves make sure you know what a holly tree looks like and avoid them when the moment arrives.
Alan are you from Enfield?
With me and my gear, I find bulk worse than the weight.
.
This rucksack's side pockets are almost useless if you want to use them once you've already stuffed the main compartment (my biggest gripe with the thing.)
T
. I roll my tent and tent poles up like a sausage and then horizontally secure them across the top of the rucksack.
I'm glad Alan mentioned the ice cream container - It made me go and check how big it was - when I went in the freezer there was a 900 mil container with some triple choc left in it.
It was lovely O0
I often wonder what we all take when we go hiking? I couldn't even know how to fill a 65L rucksack?
Hello Alan,
What a good discussion you've started!
Is the Naturhike tent the 2 man, front entrance one, or is it a side entrance tent? Anyway, I to have been looking at tents (as if I ain't got enough already!) but I think the retail therapy temptation is a hard one to resist, it is for me anyway!
Alan, I'll be selling a Cumulus Quantum (780gms) in excellent nick, that might suit you. Check out one or two reviews if it might be of interest.
For daily fitness walks I've now dropped the weight down to 41-42 lbs, (which I am comfortable and happy carrying on the lanes and tracks around us - just enough to get a 'sweat on' and keep the body weight in line and I can maintain an average of 3.5 mpg) of which food & water is around 13lbs and there are all sorts of 'bits and bobs' thrown in to make up the weight.
When on 'proper' multi-day hikes it is re-packed with whatever is necessary for the conditions / duration and is generally 5lbs+ lighter.
Weights are :
Rucksack : 1.7kg
Tent, Sleeping Bag, Mat, Footprint : 4.08kg
Stove, Gas Cartridge, Pots, Pans Bowls, Cup, Cutlery, Washing Up Kit : 1.42kg
Change of Clothing, Hat, Gloves, Washing Kit, Gaiters, Camp Slippers : 3.38kg
Bits & Bobs (1st Aid Kit, Trowel, Loo Paper, Radio, Kindle, Multi-Tool, Solar 'Battery Bank*' & Leads, Torch, Head Light, GPS, etc etc). :2.22kg
Total 12.8 kgs (28lbs)
*Solar Battery bank weighs 234g and will re-charge my Kindle, GPS, Watch, Phone, Head Light, Torch & power the USB Tent Lamp
Wow that’s a lot of unnecessary weight your carrying! Is your kit for 3/4season use?
Change your pack last. Do you actually need a Two person tent! Your cookset is very heavy, what’s your cooking preference? Sleep system is heavy too, and what is your budget? You can always buy good second hand products from people whom are dropping their pack weight too.
Alan, firstly I have to say that you are carrying way too much superfluous gear...Most of that kit won't be used, or it's too heavy and elaborate, so it would be better left at home, reducing both weight and the volume of the backpack you need to carry it all in, which in turn will save even more weight. Your Berghaus 65 litre rucksack is very heavy and bulky...If you really want a backpack of that size, then there are several backpacks out there, of similar capacity that are around half the weight. For instance, the $325, 64 litre Zpacks Arc Haul Zip, which at 780g, is less than half the weight of your Berghaus. However, if you use ultralight gear which can be packed smaller, allowing you to use a slightly smaller backpack, you could get away with something like a $325, 55 litre Zpacks Arc Blast instead, which weighs just £595g, a massive 1.105kg lighter than your Berghaus!
Good point.
I have a Berghaus Trailhead 65 that weighs in at 1.7 kgs empty which for its size and strength seems to be comparable with, and lighter than, many.
Tent 'footprint' is 0.23kg.
My sleeping bag is a candidate for weight reduction being a Vango Wilderness (rated 5 / 0 / -15) and weighs 1.5kg inc stuff sack.
Self Inflating Sleeping mat weighs in at 0.99kg.
Total weight of 'cooking equipment' comes in at 1.4Kgs(P51 Can Opener, Aluminium Foil, Lighter, Washing up Liquid, Pan Scourer, Piezo-Ignition Stove, Stove Stand / Remote Gas Adapter, Plastic Spatula, Tea-Spoon,Titanium Saucepan & Frying Pan, Gas Stove, 220g Colman Gas Cartridge (Will Boil ~ 13 Litres Water), Folding Wood Stove (With Paper & Kindling), 1x 'long' Lighter, Stainless Steel Bowls (2x 50g), 250ml Stainless Steel Cup, 2x Aluminium Foil 'Pans', Aluminium Stove Wind-Break, Tea-Towel).
Self inflating mats like yours are very heavy too, offer little in the way of comfort and do not pack down small...A Kylmit Inertia X-Frame would be far more comfortable, packs down to the size of a Coke can and weighs just 241g,
Your Berghaus 65 litre rucksack is very heavy and bulky...If you really want a backpack of that size, then there are several backpacks out there, of similar capacity that are around half the weight. For instance, the 64 litre Zpacks Arc Haul Zip, which at 780g, is less than half the weight, but use ultralight gear, which can be packed smaller, allowing you to use a smaller backpack, like a 55 litre Zpacks Arc Blast which weighs just £595g, 1.105kg lighter than your Berghaus! Your sleeping bag is very heavy too...A Marmot Phase 30 Down sleeping bag, has the 8same comfort rating as your Vango but it's 3 times lighter! Self inflating mats like yours are very heavy too, offer little in the way of comfort and do not pack down small...A Kylmit Inertia X-Frame would be far more comfortable, packs down to the size of a Coke can and weighs just 241g, almost 750g lighter than your self inflating mat! By choosing these ultralight options you can easiily save several kilos. As you might suspect, some of these options are quite expensive, so if are serious about saving serious amounts of weight, i'm afraid it's going to cost you serious amounts of money!Some very valid points there from April :)
quote author=marmottungsten link=topic=36044.msg519641#msg519641 date=1526608527]
Alan, firstly I have to say that you are carrying way too much superfluous gear...Most of that kit won't be used and can be left at home, reducing both weight and the volume of the backpack you need to carry it all in, which in turn will save even more weight. Your Berghaus 65 litre rucksack is very heavy and bulky...If you really want a backpack of that size, then there are several backpacks out there, of similar capacity that are around half the weight. For instance, the 64 litre Zpacks Arc Haul Zip, which at 780g, is less than half the weight, but use ultralight gear, which can be packed smaller, allowing you to use a smaller backpack, like a 55 litre Zpacks Arc Blast which weighs just £595g, 1.105kg lighter than your Berghaus! Your sleeping bag is very heavy too...A Marmot Phase 30 Down sleeping bag, has the same comfort rating as your Vango but it's 3 times lighter! Self inflating mats like yours are very heavy too, offer little in the way of comfort and do not pack down small...A Kylmit Inertia X-Frame would be far more comfortable, packs down to the size of a Coke can and weighs just 241g, almost 750g lighter than your self inflating mat! By choosing these ultralight options you can easiily save several kilos. As you might suspect, some of these options are quite expensive, so if are serious about saving serious amounts of weight, i'm afraid it's going to cost you serious amounts of money!
Thank you for taking the time to reply but you seem to have missed my latest post (it was immediately before your post) where you will see I have replaced some gear (sleeping bag down by 50% and sleep mat down by 50%).
I have looked at the X-Frame but being a 'side sleeper' it is totally and utterly useless - being just a 'string of sausage balloons tied together at random points' give no support at all.
Having read various reviews of it your recommendation appears to be unique - are you a Marmot / Klymit employee ?
Even users reviews on the Klymit website use it with an extra foam pad (there goes any weight & bulk saving).
Being 6 foot, a 'side sleeper' fairly 'wide and heavy' (93kgs) I unfortunately fail to meet any of the criteria for use of the X-Frame.
(https://outdoorgearlab-mvnab3pwrvp3t0.stackpathdns.com/photos/13/85/259983_26898_L.jpg)
Although the X Frame is impressively lightweight and compact, it has several drawbacks that restrict its use to a specific group of people.
1) The pad's air baffles are "body mapped" to fit someone about 5' 10" in height. Depending on how your body parts match up to it, the pad may not fit you. The pad is also the narrowest of the 20 we tested — it's 18" wide as opposed to the standard 20" width. Thus, wider people may not fit on it.
2) The pad is ideal for people who sleep on their backs and don't thrash about at night. You may not find the Inertia X Frame to be comfortable if you turn over frequently, sleep on your side, or curl excessively.
3) The pad's thin baffles and large open spaces do a poor job at insulating you from the ground below; the pad is best for summer use.
In sum, the Inertia X Frame could be a good choice for summer backpacking if you're around 5' 10" and sleep on your back.
I've always found it easy to make mistakes with equipment, I'm now on my 3rd rucksack. I'm now happy with what I've got and will not be buying another. I'm also on my 3rd Thermarest, my original is great to sleep on but a bit bulky, I now use it in the house for me to sleep on when we have visitors. I prefer to be downstairs because I am always the first one up and doing in the mornings. I also have a thin Thermarest which I use in my Bivi, which rolls up very nicely to carry, but its drawback is that I have to be so precise with its pressure, too little and my hip becomes painful, too much and its like sleeping on a brick. I'm very happy with my Neo Air, expensive but so comfortable and so easy to roll into a small pack.
I like my Pulsar 1 tent but I need to replace it because four of the poles have snapped (a teenager fell on it, or was pushed) and I can't get new one. I also have a Zepyros 1, which is best for the winter, this I think is a strong tent.
I tried Marmot UK and Marmot USA, they could not help me. I even sent my broken poles to a couple of other firms but again nothing. In the meantime I've managed to bodge them together with sticky tape and the tent is now OK again, but I always know now that I am in a defective tent. I did this some months ago but thanks to your information I might try again.
At 5Kg, no way. The Cinch tent may be OK for car campers but carrying that weight on top of everything else puts it in the unfeasible bin for backpackers.Bit late to this discussion, but I have gone to a pyramid tent (after a Vnago Banshee), mainly because I wanted something I could sit up in. Since getting it (Lux Hexpeak), I've realised that unlike the Vango, I can raise the pole if I want more breeze... It's possible to raise it high enough to crawl under the flysheet - good for hot weather or airing the tent in the morning. It isn't very warm in winter though - most of the inner is mesh, just enough fabric to be higher than me when lying down, so drafts are reduced when sleeping.
P.S. how you getting on with your bivvi? I'm thinking seriously of the DD super light pyramid tent, since I could not use my coffin tent fly only.
I have the LightHeart SoLong 6 with awning and two doors. Looked at, bought and tried the solo, but was too cramped for me. I also didn't like the wasted space in the pointed ends.
Only problem in FL summer is condensation. Seam sealed it myself with the recommended 1/2 - 1/2 mineral spirits and 100% silicone caulking and have had NO leaks.
I'm 220 #, 6'2". SoLong 6 fits great
I have the LightHeart SoLong 6 with awning and two doors. Looked at, bought and tried the solo, but was too cramped for me. I also didn't like the wasted space in the pointed ends.You may find this useful
Only problem in FL summer is condensation. Seam sealed it myself with the recommended 1/2 - 1/2 mineral spirits and 100% silicone caulking and have had NO leaks.
I'm 220 #, 6'2". SoLong 6 fits great
You may find this useful
https://mountainsforeverybody.com/prevent-tent-condensation (https://mountainsforeverybody.com/prevent-tent-condensation)
"The reality is that you cannot prevent tent condensation, this is a normal physical process. It comes due to the cooling of the hot air inside the tent on the walls of the tent. The vapor from the air loses its energy in contact with the cold wall and it transforms into the liquid."
"Here is a nice video by MSR with some details about condensation in the tent. I am a physicist by profession and can say they have described the phenomenon quite accurately. Please have a look"
Your very welcome Alan ;D
I have saved the link - it may come in useful next time one of the 'super-lightweighters' with a single skin tent or tarpaulin get into deep and meaningful discussions about condensation.
Its a good video clip - thanks.