Author Topic: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread  (Read 9808 times)

mananddog

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #15 on: 10:26:45, 04/08/09 »
Kinder can be exciting though. A year last winter I went for a walk with a few mates. The mist obscured visibility to about 50m on the plataeu map and compass were needed to come from the north over from Blackden brook Clough - we were making for Kinder downfall. Working on the compass we thought we must be getting near - suddenly I was drenched by a deluge of water - we had found Kinder downfall - we were still about 400m from it! The force of the wind was carrying the water way over the moors. Click picture to see video.


« Last Edit: 14:05:32, 04/08/09 by mananddog »

genji

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #16 on: 10:29:50, 04/08/09 »
That is amazing, man. I've only ever seen upside-down waterfalls in Disneyworld.
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scenic

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #17 on: 13:04:58, 04/08/09 »
Glad to hear that you enjoyed the ascent of Grindsbrook, and pleased to hear that you've not given up on Kinder. Yes, it is a bleak place - which some like and some don't - but although it's a small area there are so many walks that can be built around it. I definitely think it's a place worth getting to know well.

I have to say that if heading east at the top of Grindsbrook made you depressed, then heading west may well make you suicidal! Really, it's much 'more', even if you keep to the edge paths.

Others may correct me, but I don't think there's a path NW from Crowden to the Downfall. If there isn't then you'll be walking in a world of your nightmares, you'll be sliding and slipping down the sides of peat groughs and sinking into the peat at the bottom of them, there'll be precious few landmarks or features and you won't have a clue where you are or where you're going. It is fantastic!

If you'd like to see the Downfall then Dizzy's suggestion of a walk from Hayfield is a good one.

But whatever you do, I hope you enjoy the adventure  O0
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genji

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #18 on: 13:31:29, 04/08/09 »
Others may correct me, but I don't think there's a path NW from Crowden to the Downfall. If there isn't then you'll be walking in a world of your nightmares, you'll be sliding and slipping down the sides of peat groughs and sinking into the peat at the bottom of them, there'll be precious few landmarks or features and you won't have a clue where you are or where you're going. It is fantastic!

Thanks scenic. This is why I posted my intentions - if that path doesn't exist at all then I'll not be as keen to take it.

This is the map of the area:


The path leads from Grindsbrook, past Crowden Tower, to Kinder Downfall.

Here's the satellite image (from 2009):


You can see the outline of the path north of Crowden Tower and south-east of Kinder Downfall, but it disappears somewhere in the middle. I can appreciate that it won't be the most well defined path in the Peak District, but apart from the middle bit does anyone know if the start and the end are well defined?
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vghikers

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #19 on: 13:46:22, 04/08/09 »
There is no path (at least not in the normally accepted sense of the word!).
What you see in the NW part of the image is the main drainage channel that accumulates the countless tiny  trickles from the peat groughs. That is nevertheless the best line overall if you are attempting a direct crossing, since the floors of the main channel are gritty sandy stuff that is generally easier than clambering in and out of the groughs. In the SE part you may find sporadic evidence of a flattened 'line' weaving around through the peaty morass but nothing more.

scenic

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #20 on: 13:55:26, 04/08/09 »
Well I'm confident in what I'm saying, but I'm not sure.

I think what the satellite image shows is the major peat groughs, not paths. As you can see from the image, if you start walking in or alongside the right one at Crowden and can find your way into the right one in the middle of the plateau, then much of the navigational work is done for you.

Trouble is that if the plateau is soggy you may not be able to walk at the base of the groughs and if you try and walk at the top of the groughs you have to cross all the many mini-tributries that branch from the grough. Crossing these tributry groughs can be far from straight-forward - you can walk fifty yards to progress five - and you'll probably need to keep a constant check on your compass.

Your intended route is a fine one, and that particular crossing is one I've wanted to do for some time. It's just that having read what you wrote about your previous Kinder caper, I can't see you enjoying this one.
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scenic

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #21 on: 13:56:55, 04/08/09 »
That is nevertheless the best line overall if you are attempting a direct crossing, since the floors of the main channel are gritty sandy stuff that is generally easier than clambering in and out of the groughs.

That's useful info  O0
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vghikers

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #22 on: 14:13:16, 04/08/09 »
The big channels are often gritty underfoot but you'll probably still spend a lot of time slithering around on the steep peaty banks at frequent intervals  :). Great place to hone compass skills!.

genji

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #23 on: 14:52:23, 04/08/09 »
...having read what you wrote about your previous Kinder caper, I can't see you enjoying this one.

That would be a fairly safe bet but for me there's something to be gained from taking that route. Instead of having walked a couple of miles along the paved southern edge I'll at least have seen a little of the inner plateau and Kinder Downfall. It'll be a mental challenge as much as anything. However, I won't be going up there full of romantic expectations this time. If I dislike the place so much after the second visit then at least I'll know what I'm talking about a bit better than I do at present.

Thanks for the input and experience, guys. I was considering doing it this Saturday, but I think Ollie wants to come on this weekend's walk and I don't want to put him through it until I've completed it myself and I know what to expect (Lai San's up for anything!). The plateau 'path' alone is about two miles, assuming we get it right, and it could take a long time to complete.

Maybe we'll do Malham/Gordale Scar instead. ;)

By the way, where is the summit of Kinder? The highest point on the map that I can see is an unannotated point of 636 metres on the CP boundary between Edale and Hayfield, just north of Edale Head.
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vghikers

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #24 on: 15:13:44, 04/08/09 »
Quote
By the way, where is the summit of Kinder? The highest point on the map that I can see is an unannotated point of 636 metres on the CP boundary between Edale and Hayfield, just north of Edale Head.

That's it.
When we visited it years ago it was marked by a cairn with a post sticking out of it, you could see it quite clearly in the distance from the trig point on Kinder Low. The area is is a horizontal sea of undulating peat though, and the highest point - if such can ever be determined - can move around due to weather erosion of the peat hags.  I don't know if that cairn and post are still there (or in the same place as last time!), it's a while since I looked.

Dizzy

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #25 on: 16:13:05, 04/08/09 »
Genji,

That is exactly the path that I tried and had to retreat from.It had been raining heavily then and it has lately too so be careful.The sandy gritty riverbed that seems ok to walk along soon disappears and you end up knee deep in peat with every step.Its also an extremely disorientating place, because all you can see is black peat all around for miles.I will try and find a photo from our trip but unless you are really confident at following and sticking to a bearing then only try it in dry weather when the peat isn't as wet.The problem is when you sink upto your knees that its difficult to pull your legs out again!I had a strong pair of arms to pull me out and even he had trouble ;D.I know that all of the experienced walkers will disagree with me but as a relative newbie it scared the c**p out of me.If I had been on my own I wouldn't have had a clue how to get back to the edge again.

Sorry people who love it, this is just my opinion and I won't ever try to cross the plateau again, once was quite enough!

genji

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #26 on: 16:24:07, 04/08/09 »
Genji,

That is exactly the path that I tried and had to retreat from.It had been raining heavily then and it has lately too so be careful.The sandy gritty riverbed that seems ok to walk along soon disappears and you end up knee deep in peat with every step.Its also an extremely disorientating place, because all you can see is black peat all around for miles.I will try and find a photo from our trip but unless you are really confident at following and sticking to a bearing then only try it in dry weather when the peat isn't as wet.The problem is when you sink upto your knees that its difficult to pull your legs out again!I had a strong pair of arms to pull me out and even he had trouble ;D.I know that all of the experienced walkers will disagree with me but as a relative newbie it scared the c**p out of me.If I had been on my own I wouldn't have had a clue how to get back to the edge again.

Sorry people who love it, this is just my opinion and I won't ever try to cross the plateau again, once was quite enough!

Cheers Dizzy. Well, it's unlikely to happen this weekend (although this week is forecast to be dry and sunny until Sunday, so Saturday might not be a bad day to try), and then we're in the Lakes, then we have the weakling meet-up, so it's going to be September at the earliest.

What's the best gear for bog-hopping? Waterproof trousers inside gaiters? Wellies and a sou'wester?
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Dizzy

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #27 on: 16:27:29, 04/08/09 »
soz didn't work, try again.....

« Last Edit: 16:29:56, 04/08/09 by Dizzy »

Yomper

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #28 on: 16:30:09, 04/08/09 »
A piggy-back !!  :D


 :2funny:

genji

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Re: Another bloody Kinder Scout thread
« Reply #29 on: 17:27:26, 04/08/09 »
Holy cack, Dizzy. That looks ace. Wet and slutchy, and I see what you mean about not going after a prolonged period of rain, but the environment looks brilliant. So the groughs are the channels where you're stood? What are the higher grassy bits called? That could be fun, which is not a term I ever thought I'd use in connection with Kinder Scout. I thought it'd be a boggy, tussocky wetlands like Jura. That's like being in Honey I Shrunk The Kids. Not sure I'd want to put my lovely boots in it though.

How far in is that? How long does that go on for? The full two miles to Downfall?
"pain is your bodies way of telling you that it is hurting"

 

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