Kinder question

[botty]

I've seen posts on here suggesting that some parts of Kinder are quite difficult to navigate due to the lack of features. I might be doing the loop from Edale tomorrow taking in Kinder Downfall, then cutting across to Crowden Tower and down Grindsbrook Clough - I assume it's quite a common walk at around 9.25 miles. I've not walked this area before so was just wondering if the path from Kinder Downfall to Crowden Tower is a clearly marked path, as looking at a couple of satellite views it doesn't appear to be so in places.

[botty]

Or, would I be better walking back down the same path from Kinder Downfall to Swine's Back, then heading along the ridge past Noe Stool and the Woolpacks and back to Edale that way?

[Fleegle]

I think the first piece of advice I would give, is double check the weather for tomorrow. I've just looked at MWIS and it is suggesting a cloudbase of 350 mtrs. Considering the plateau is well in excess of that, at around 600 mtrs, it might be wise to consider another day.
http://www.mwis.org.uk/mountain/PD.PDF
In answer to your question, the plateau is generally featureless with lots of water eroded ravines. That doesn't mean there are no features, just that they are very few and far between. So your navigation skills ideally need to be very good for a safe passage, even with the use of a GPS!
If the GPS should fail, then you would need to fall back on good nav skills, in low cloud and very likely rain and the strong possibilty of buffetting from the wind.
Though I've not walked the outer edge of the plateau, it does look like there is some form of navigable footpath,m but how good and hoow much, I do not know. Perhaps someone else might be able to advise on that one.
Unfortunately, I'm busy the following weekend, otherwise I would offer to join you, weather permitting.

[Fleegle]

Sorry, I meant to add a link with some photos I took on Kinder last year.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/leaping_jaguar/sets/72157626429092814/

[Dazza]

If that forecast holds I'd definitely put Kinder off the list. If you fancy braving the edges I'd definitely leave the plateau off the menu.

Paths around the edges of Kinder are generally easy to follow, but there are places where the sheer volume of traffic has removed a clear foot path, some where the path is fairly narrow and the usual footpaths that aren't on the map.

The plateau is best done after a dry spell and when the weathers clear. That way you won't get bogged down (literally, it can be many feet deep in places) and can walk a relatively straight route. At it's soggy best you end up going in the right general direction but sticking to the grassy hags due to the huge amounts of mud, a 2 mile route can easily double as you have to work around the bogs.

Navigation is best described as interesting, though it's not too bad as heading West or South will get you to one of the edge paths fairly soon to get  back to edale. Going North will have the same effect if you're looking at Snake Pass (obviously you can get to edale but it's more of a trek). GPS is handy, especially if the weather does close in, though the usual caveats apply.

Hope I haven't put you off, it's a unique and quite special place (though it helps if you like mud!).


Edit -
Heres a trip report of mine when it was nice and dry. Imagine the brown peaty bits, being all black and soaking mud for the wet version.

http://www.walkingforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,9485.0.html

[ianj37]

The paths on the southern edge of the plateau are mostly very clear and some parts have been paved for added convenience! The path from Edale Rocks to the Downfall isn't clear for small parts but there are several well placed cairns to follow.

You are right that the path from Kinder Gates to Crowden Tower isn't too clear and personally I'd suggest that the first time you do this should be in relatively good weather as even then it can be it a bit featureless (see attached) and when the mist comes down 'a wild and lonelky place'!

 Walking on a bearing can be challenging not only because of the sparicty of clear points to navigate on but also because the Park Authority, for very good reasons, have fairly recently installed dams in many of the groughs to stop the peat drying out thus making the mud or water quite deep. This produces another challenge of remebering which of many similar features you're navigating on whilst walking around trying to find the shallowest point to cross.  The tops of some of the dams were broken - I'm assuming this is done by people assuming that whilst the plastic is only about 5mm across they can use it for a flying leap - clearly that often doesn't work.

I was up there on Tuesday and intended to go back today but  got directed to other duties


When you do go I hope you have a good time - it's a great place.

[botty]

I think the first piece of advice I would give, is double check the weather for tomorrow. I've just looked at MWIS and it is suggesting a cloudbase of 350 mtrs. Considering the plateau is well in excess of that, at around 600 mtrs, it might be wise to consider another day.

Might take that advice - thanks. I've been watching the BBC forecast all day and it looked like a good day for tomorrow, in fact I packed up my lunch ready for tomorrow. Just looked at the forecast again and it's changed and showing heavy rain early tomorrow then cloud until the afternoon. 


Might have to think of somewhere else to go or even give it a miss depending on the forecast in the morning.

[Peak Lad]

Hi botty, as Fleegle said, in bad weather, it can be a real challenge to navigate up there, i walk up on Kinder nearly every week in all weathers and always show it respect  just pick a nice day, it will not dissapoint

[Fleegle]

Hi Botty, I can assure tou, pick the right dat and you'll not be disappointed.
I would be happy to join tou one dat, and walk the plateau. I guess one or two others would like to as well.
I have great intentions of returning, because I want to visit one or more of the plane crash sites.
Last time I aborted because of the weather.

[botty]

Just been perusing the map, and depending on the weather in the morning I might park at Langsett Reservoir and go on a circuit around Thurlstone Moors - not an area I've been to but there looks to be some decent paths and plenty of places and features to look out for if the weather isn't great. Bit of a difference, but I'll see how I feel in the morning.

[Peak Lad]

Fleegle, what bad weather was that     meet up with you  next time

[Fleegle]

Fleegle, what bad weather was that     meet up with you  next time

  It was only a drop of, well, almost, rain.....     
Joking aside, it did provide a valuable experience for Fleegle Jnr, who until then, had only experienced sunny summits. That in my book provided a valuable day.   

[botty]

Well after the forecast last night showed rain and cloud I decided not to bother going for a walk (other factors as well) - well 9:30am and it's been lovely and sunny for the last couple of hours and the BBC is now showing yet another completely different forecast to the one at 10pm last night! I can understand how forecasts for a few days ahead can often change, but it's so frustrating when often the forecast can be so wrong for just 12hrs ahead

[Fleegle]

Well after the forecast last night showed rain and cloud I decided not to bother going for a walk (other factors as well) - well 9:30am and it's been lovely and sunny for the last couple of hours and the BBC is now showing yet another completely different forecast to the one at 10pm last night! I can understand how forecasts for a few days ahead can often change, but it's so frustrating when often the forecast can be so wrong for just 12hrs ahead

I still think it was a wise decission not to venture on to Kinder.
I was at Ashford in the water, in the White Peak today (Saturday), for the Well Dressings. We had brief showers followed by sunny spells followed by brief showers and so on.
On the journey up from the Midlands, looking over towards the Dark Peak, it looked cloud covered.
Frustrating I know when you build yourself up for a nice jolly out, but its better to be safe than sorry, Kinder will be there for many years to come and long after we've gone....

[botty]

Ignore please

Do you mean ignore because the walk isn't worth it (I didn't go in the end but it's a 'back-up' walk) or because it's in a post relating to Kinder, or something else...