Author Topic: Leave them to die!  (Read 1754 times)

fernman

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #15 on: 23:09:17, 07/08/17 »
The bloke who made the comment in the first place is a classic troll - he's making an outrageous statement in the expectation of getting exactly this kind of reaction

That was my first thought when I read the comment. Thank you for putting in writing.

phil1960

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #16 on: 07:37:10, 08/08/17 »
That was my first thought when I read the comment. Thank you for putting in writing.
Yep what they said  O0
Touching from a distance, further all the time.

willow229

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #17 on: 12:37:28, 08/08/17 »
Agree with Mike Knipe, classic troll type comment. The leader of Patterdale MRT has posted a lovely comment further down on the thread.

gunwharfman

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #18 on: 14:29:55, 08/08/17 »
I know the word 'troll' is used a lot but I can never get my head around about what it actually means? When I read the people who are identified as such, I see an alternative opinion to mine, even if they are being serious I assume they are being deliberately provocative, or demonstrating to the reader that they have a lot of unresolved personal problem and other problems as well? The title to me seems just too simplistic to warrant giving them such a label, or is it a status?

ninthace

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #19 on: 14:55:31, 08/08/17 »
I think the term troll originally came from fishing rather than goat hunting or Scandinavian fairy tales. I believe in fishing it means drifting along, trailing your bait and hoping for a bite. Perhaps anglers out there can enlighten us?
Solvitur Ambulando

White Horse Walker

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #20 on: 14:06:05, 09/08/17 »
I too have seen people totally ill-equipped for the conditions in which we're walking but since when has stupidity and perhaps thoughtlessness been punishable by death?
If I were rescued by a charitable concern, I'd bend over backwards (and would then need rescuing again no doubt) to publicise their good work and to raise funds for them. Hopefully these unfortunate people will do the same.


This August is unseasonably cold - I've put my central heating on several times this month already and don't recall ever having done that in August before. Clearly it has caught people out.
~
Sue

Lakeland Lorry

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #21 on: 15:56:04, 09/08/17 »
I was out on the Lake District fells on Sunday and had seen the forecast, which said that heavy rain was going to set in around 1pm.   So, because of that forecast, we choose to do a shorter route than orginally planned.   

When we reached the summit of Seat Sandal, at about 11:30, I was surprised at how strong and cold the wind was.   So cold, in fact, that all of us were forced to put on hats and gloves - and that was before the rain started.   I've never known it to be that cold in August before, and I've been walking the Lake District for many years.   

By the time the rain started, bang on time at 1pm, we were back down at valley level.   The rain was extremely heavy.   In Grasmere, where we were, it was torrential and I had my windscreen wipers on double speed all the way back to Keswick.

The weather on Sunday was extreme and, in my opinion, it was a lot colder and rained more heavily than forecasted.   Fortunately, as an experienced fell walker, I was able to pre-judge the weather and adjust my route accordingly.   However, I can easily see how it would catch out novice fell walkers, or those with limited fell walking experience.

Hopefully the group that was rescued won't be put off by what they went through, and they will learn by their mistake and, next time they venture out on the fells, will be more prepared.   

Praise should go to the couple who stopped to help the group and called out the mountain rescue, and also to the various mountain rescue teams who give up their valuable time, and also risks their lives, in saving others. 


Dyffryn Ardudwy

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #22 on: 17:00:14, 09/08/17 »
This unfortunately is becoming a recurring problem, ill equipped, and more often than not, total novices, totally out of their comfort levels, in desolate countryside.
Without making it law, that those taking part in out door recreation, are properly insured, even if its only say 10 a year, just in case some calamity occurs, what else can be done.
The lure of the hills, is incredible, but until there is a call out charge to bring out the Mountain rescue, certain members of society will continue to flout the free service.

If the call out fee was set at around 30, then that would deter a small percentage of walkers, walkers who are risking both themselves, and the Mountain rescue team.

Remember, the vast majority of us, spend considerably more than that, to reach the mountains of our choice, and yet we expect volunteers to risk life and limb, for nothing.

There has to be something put in place, to stop a tiny minority of walkers venturing into the hills, in totally unsuitable clothing for the terrain.

Ignorance is no excuse, as even those with a slightest bit of intelligence must realise high mountains, in poor weather pose a risk to the unprepared.


If nothing is done in the for seeable future, this problem will only become more acute, with the increase in visitors to our National Parks on the increase.

I can venture up Snowdon or some other popular mountain, in what ever clothing i like, knowing the Mountain rescue are a single call away, 24/12.
« Last Edit: 17:05:10, 09/08/17 by Dyffryn Ardudwy »

Owen

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #23 on: 17:33:41, 09/08/17 »

If nothing is done in the for seeable future, this problem will only become more acute, with the increase in visitors to our National Parks on the increase.



I've been going out into the hills for very nearly 40 years now and yes the number of people heading out has increased exponentially. But no I don't think the number of ill prepared people has increased much at all, in fact I think it may well have decreased. In general the message is getting through.


As for charging for rescue, that is the most ill thought out idea I've heard in ages. The very people who really should call out the rescue will hold off until it's too late. This will lead to more deaths on the hills not less.

pauldawes

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #24 on: 17:43:44, 09/08/17 »

I've been going out into the hills for very nearly 40 years now and yes the number of people heading out has increased exponentially. But no I don't think the number of ill prepared people has increased much at all, in fact I think it may well have decreased. In general the message is getting through.


As for charging for rescue, that is the most ill thought out idea I've heard in ages. The very people who really should call out the rescue will hold off until it's too late. This will lead to more deaths on the hills not less.


I'm actually open minded on idea of a modest call out charge...and thought the 30 quid (suggested by DA) was in about right range IF idea was implemented.


The idea wouldn't be to discourage people in serious danger from making a call out (nor would I suggest people being rigorously pursued for payment...if anybody isn't grateful enough to quickly pay up voluntarily, I'd leave them in peace)...no the idea would be to limit calls from people who are in mild discomfort.


If anybody in serious danger fails to call because of a potential small charge...then their mind must be a curious object.


For me, the clincher "yea or nay" would be heavily determined by whatever the mountain rescue teams themselves want. And I'd guess those selfless heroes would probably say "no fee".


Ridge

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #25 on: 18:21:46, 09/08/17 »

I'm not sure I've the strength for this but here goes

This unfortunately is becoming a recurring problem, ill equipped, and more often than not, total novices, totally out of their comfort levels, in desolate countryside.
People needing help on the hills has always been a recurring problem
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Without making it law, that those taking part in out door recreation, are properly insured, even if its only say 10 a year, just in case some calamity occurs, what else can be done.
Where exactly on a scale of Patterdale to Helvellyn would be the line which can not be crossed without insurance?
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The lure of the hills, is incredible, but until there is a call out charge to bring out the Mountain rescue, certain members of society will continue to flout the free service.
But that must be everyone who needs the service which is flouting it as they have done something where they have ended up needing help
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If the call out fee was set at around 30, then that would deter a small percentage of walkers, walkers who are risking both themselves, and the Mountain rescue team.
The people in the report who needed help didn't call the MRT.
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Remember, the vast majority of us, spend considerably more than that, to reach the mountains of our choice, and yet we expect volunteers to risk life and limb, for nothing.
We do, and they are great people. I've never heard any MRT suggest charging or a call out fee.
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There has to be something put in place, to stop a tiny minority of walkers venturing into the hills, in totally unsuitable clothing for the terrain.
Why? and what is unsuitable?  I regularly see people on the hills if trainers, nylon shorts and vests with no provisions, presumably they should be the first to be banned.
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Ignorance is no excuse, as even those with a slightest bit of intelligence must realise high mountains, in poor weather pose a risk to the unprepared.
Ignorance can be an excuse if you are not a walker and it is sunny down in the valley. I'm sure we've all misjudged it sometimes.
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If nothing is done in the for seeable future, this problem will only become more acute, with the increase in visitors to our National Parks on the increase.
True but if you read through MRT reports the vast majority of rescues are well prepared experienced walkers so obviously they are the ones who should be banned from the hills
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I can venture up Snowdon or some other popular mountain, in what ever clothing i like, knowing the Mountain rescue are a single call away, 24/12.
You can, aren't we lucky to have such selfless people looking out for us.


I know the word 'troll' is used a lot but I can never get my head around about what it actually means?
Someone who posts something inflammatory just to get a rise out of people.
Over hill, over dale. Thorough brush, thorough brier....
I do wander every where

April

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #26 on: 18:46:52, 09/08/17 »
Thank you Ridge for writing what, I hope, most of us are thinking  O0

As Lakeland Lorry says it was extremely cold on Sunday, we were saying to each other it was like winter and not summer, the weather was worse than forecast and we had gloves, hat/hoods on too when we were on Seat Sandal summit in the morning. We said hello to Lakeland Lorry on her way up. Thanks to the 2 walkers, Tony and Jen, who came across the group in trouble in the shelter and called the MRT because they knew it was serious and thanks to the other 4 lads who stopped to help too.

I hope you enjoyed your walk Lakeland Lorry, nice to see you again  :)

"Who would've thought...... you are light and darkness coming through" words by Tim Armstrong

Percy

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #27 on: 18:55:16, 09/08/17 »
This unfortunately is becoming a recurring problem
Indeed it is. You frequently demonstrate that you are lacking a fully functioning brain and any hint of empathy.

Glyno

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #28 on: 18:59:01, 09/08/17 »

I can venture up Snowdon or some other popular mountain, in what ever clothing i like, knowing the Mountain rescue are a single call away, 24/12.


do they operate on a 12 day week?


 :)

Penygadair

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Re: Leave them to die!
« Reply #29 on: 19:15:49, 09/08/17 »
Excellent posts from Ridge, Percy and Glyno.  O0