Author Topic: I was so cold last night!  (Read 1299 times)

gunwharfman

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I was so cold last night!
« on: 09:55:19, 19/04/21 »
I camped out last night. I used my tarp. I camped on grass, the air was still and the sky was clear. It was certainly cool as I got myself organised but I didn't judge it as cold, certainly not winter cold.

I put my base layer in place, inflated my Thermarest NeoAir, and placed it on top. My sleeping quilt was inside my Alpkit Hunka and on top of my NeoAir. I wore a beanie, a base layer, long johns, and socks and got in. Within the hour I felt chilly so put on my warm anorak and fell asleep again. I then awoke at 2 am feeling very cold around my hip area, I placed my blue square sit-on-mat under my NeoAir at hip level, I then felt ok and dozed off again but woke again an hour later this time feeling cold all over.

I got up, had a walk around, the grass was wet, I jumped up and down and then got back into my sleeping quilt and Hunka. By now the inside of my tarp was wet with condensation as well. I managed to doze off again and woke at 6.30 am. The grass was very wet around me.

That's the first time I've ever felt cold from the ground up through my NeoAir and one of the few occasions I've felt cold all over. I'm now wondering if I would have felt so cold if I had been inside my tent? And of course, was the weather that I experienced 'special' in some way, and if so how and why? A new experience for me so I'd like to work out why it happened.

I'm camping again on Tuesday night and I'm going to try something that Stube suggested. a length of silver-backed thin 'insulation' which I bought from B & Q ages ago and an insulated car window cover why I can try as an alternative 'insulation.'. Both of which I can try individually under my Neo Air, or perhaps under my groundsheet?

I'm hoping that the weather will still be similar to last night.

Patrick1

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #1 on: 10:28:51, 19/04/21 »
Sorry to hear you had a bad night. I've a couple of thoughts, though not a definite answer!


I think cold damp air does feel a lot colder than cold dry air, so when siting your camp its worth trying to avoid localised areas of high humidity as much as possible. The still clear conditions you describe will allow cold damp air to pool in valleys, especially beside rivers, and while these appear attractive places to camp, in practice you might well be significantly warmer on a knoll raised above the valley floor - I don't know if that might have been an issue?


You're clearly trying to learn from your experiences, as do I. To that end I've recently bought a small "fridge thermometer" - only about a fiver and minimal weight, but provides interesting information on how cold it actually got overnight. I'm hoping this will allow a more informed idea of the limits of my sleeping setup, rather than just assuming that the temperature I experienced was the forecast minimum for the area.


When it does get colder than expected, a hot water bottle can make a big difference. Make sure whatever you're using as a water bottle can take boiling water (metal bottles are obviously fine, but so, I've found, are plastic coke bottles!), fill it up and take it into bed with you. Makes a substantial difference for quite a while.


Finally, I'm another fan of the silver backed insulation under the neoair. Inflatable mattresses are quite good insulators, but insulation effectiveness is to a considerable degree dependent on thickness. So where your hip is pressing into the mattress for comfort, there might only be a few mm between you and the ground, and I notice the cold coming through in such spots in a way that I don't with an extra thin layer of reflective insulation underneath.

ninthace

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #2 on: 11:33:20, 19/04/21 »
Like I said, credit card and phone - less weight to carry, guaranteed warm night and the money you would have spent on kit can pay for the B&B  ;)
You wouldn't have caught AW dossing down in a field!
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richardh1905

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #3 on: 13:52:18, 19/04/21 »
That's the first time I've ever felt cold from the ground up through my NeoAir and one of the few occasions I've felt cold all over. I'm now wondering if I would have felt so cold if I had been inside my tent?


I'm sure that you would have been warmer inside a tent, especially one with a solid inner. Likewise I see that you were using a quilt - you would probably have felt warmer in a sleeping bag - the extra layer of albeit compressed insulation under your hips would have made a difference.
WildAboutWalking - Join me on my walks through the wilder parts of Britain

gunwharfman

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #4 on: 14:45:32, 19/04/21 »
I mention my experience because as I said a new experience for me. The only comparable 'feeling so cold' was when I once tried to sleep in my car in 2018. I've felt for some time that my quilt has been losing its heat-retaining qualities which is why I've adapted by using my anorak, this is the one time it failed. I have never experienced cold through my NeoAir before definitely a new experience, I've had this a few years now.

I can adapt again, I've resisted using my Rab Alpine down jacket (I might give that a go while the weather is stable) and I've still got my backup down blanket, which was made for me recently by my wife's friend. If I carry both it's all extra weight, but not much. I might just go back to the same spot and try again tonight?

I'm loath to buy anything new, as I'm just not sure how long I can still hike for? This year yes, but next year, I just don't know, I think I'll wait until this Autumn before splashing out any real money again.

That's what I like about hiking and camping, there's always something new to think about.

I'm glad I've experienced this now, better than when I'm on an actual hike. After I got home this morning I was out again in a couple of hours to complete my 99 runs in 99 days, only ONE more to go! YES!!!

richardh1905

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #5 on: 18:17:55, 19/04/21 »
If you do buy some good new kit, and then decide to give up on walking in a year or two's time, you will be able to sell it and probably recoup the majority of its value, as long as it is still in good nick.
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Slowcoach

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #6 on: 18:38:30, 19/04/21 »
[size=0px]You wouldn't have caught AW dossing down in a field!  
[size=0px]
 
[size=0px]I remember a programme where AW said that rather than head back to base and start again the next day he wrapped up in his coat and slept in the heather.  
It's all uphill from here.

ninthace

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #7 on: 19:00:13, 19/04/21 »
[size=0px]You wouldn't have caught AW dossing down in a field!
[size=0px]

I remember a programme where AW said that rather than head back to base and start again the next day he wrapped up in his coat and slept in the heather.
Even if that is true it does not mean he ever did, let alone that he ever chose it as a preferred strategy.  Read A Pennine Journey and you will get a measure of the man. He attitude to his hosts does not come across well by modern standards.  Moreover - he binned the walk because of bad weather.
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Slowcoach

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #8 on: 19:42:39, 19/04/21 »
Even if that is true it does not mean he ever did, let alone that he ever chose it as a preferred strategy.  Read A Pennine Journey and you will get a measure of the man. He attitude to his hosts does not come across well by modern standards.  Moreover - he binned the walk because of bad weather.
Oh ye of little faith
It's all uphill from here.

watershed

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #9 on: 19:43:15, 19/04/21 »
?


I'm glad I've experienced this now, better than when I'm on an actual hike. After I got home this morning I was out again in a couple of hours to complete my 99 runs in 99 days, only ONE more to go! YES!!!


Hope you have a great run tomorrow GWM. 100 in 100 days, a great effort, well done!

Brandywell

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #10 on: 19:52:40, 19/04/21 »
Even if that is true it does not mean he ever did, let alone that he ever chose it as a preferred strategy.
But he did and advocated that everyone should spend at least one (planned) night in the open on a fell top.  Read his Memoirs of a Fellwanderer where he described a night on Harrison Stickle, beautifully written.  He preferred sleeping, or more likely dozing, in the open, rather than being enclosed in a tent where he began to imagine all sorts of dangers approaching him.
Watch where you are putting your feet : AW

weston.front

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #11 on: 21:02:03, 19/04/21 »
Sounds like the humidity was your big enemy.  Humid air conducts heat a lot more than dry air, causing heat to flow more effectively and making hot feel hotter and cold colder.
I reckon on a three season style tent giving a 2 Celsius differential to outside and a four season tent a 4 Celsius differential - you were in a bivvy bag which surely have added 1-2 C to the capability of what was inside that.  I wonder did your quilt get damp and become less effective?  The high humidity would have reduced any breathability your bivvy bag was supposed to have.
My commiserations GWM.
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richardh1905

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #12 on: 07:16:04, 20/04/21 »
..  I wonder did your quilt get damp and become less effective?  The high humidity would have reduced any breathability your bivvy bag was supposed to have.


Good point
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gunwharfman

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #13 on: 09:58:41, 20/04/21 »
Because I was in my bivvy two nights ago it didn't get wet on the inside but the outside was dripping,

I camped again last night but this time I put a shiny strip of insulating mat under my NeoAir and then put my blue sit-on square under my hip area. To finish off I just opened up my zipped and lay that over the top on my bivvy. In the morning the poncho was wet but the bivvy exterior at most was only slightly damp. I did wake but not until 4.30 am, I was no longer warm but I definitely wasn't cold this time. The weather conditions seemed to be about the same both nights. Waking at 4,30 is an irritating time, from then on I was in and out of sleep until daylight.

I've decided to not worry about my one cold night, I'm going to take the attitude that it was just a one-off. The weather is improving so I may never experience this problem again? What I really need to experience though, is to bivvy in the rain. Its never rained on me since I started to camp in this way. I've long assumed that rain is the most likely issue that will make me go back to tent camping? I've also decided that what I need to do now is to hike properly for a couple of days or so, along the South Downs Way, to gain real knowledge of bivvying. I'm just not sure though how I'll cope if I can't find a pub thats open?

weston.front

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Re: I was so cold last night!
« Reply #14 on: 11:26:50, 20/04/21 »
Now that WOULD be a serious issue!


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