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Main Boards => Gear => Topic started by: Beth FF on 17:18:26, 18/12/18

Title: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Beth FF on 17:18:26, 18/12/18

I’m mindful that if I got into trouble whilst walking the coastal paths alone I need a reliable way of summoning help, bearing in mind that phone reception in many places is poor. Although I realise ViewRanger has BuddyBeacon it needs a phone signal (doesn’t it?), plus the only time I used VR it drained my phone battery so badly I’m wary of using it, even with a power bank back up. However, many people rate it so is it worth considering despite these flaws? Because of the phone signal issues I’m considering getting a GPS device. If I get one I’d want it to:


Be rechargeable. I’m walking a few hours each day (2 days on, 1 day off, etc) so would be getting through batteries like crazy otherwise!


Let a “minder” know my location at all times, so if I’m unable to call for help and haven’t moved for a while they’ll know. Maybe even be able to send an SOS.


Be lightweight. I’m carrying everything I need for all year travel and don’t want to increase my backpack weight by any more than need be.


Apart from owning a Garmin Forerunner 35 watch I’m new to this technology so want it to be simple to use.


Can anyone advise on safety and options please? I've been trawling the internet reading up on it all but I'm just confused  :-\

Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: archaeoroutes on 17:33:10, 18/12/18
Could you just send a text with your location to someone every now and then?
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Beth FF on 17:38:26, 18/12/18
Could you just send a text with your location to someone every now and then?


That's an option I suppose. My initial reservations are that it requires a phone signal and I can't do it if incapacitated. That aside I suppose if I had a system where I'd be expected to send texts at set periods it could work if my minder didn't receive one.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: sussamb on 17:56:45, 18/12/18
Hi Beth, just twigged who you are  :)

Unless you pay for something like InReach, which relies on signals via satellite rather than mobile phone masts, https://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/shop/outdoorgear/garmin-inreach-mini.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIpN7Xmvmp3wIVUeR3Ch3xgAJkEAQYASABEgLdMfD_BwE your best/cheapest bet is to do as posted above and agree with someone that you'll text them your position at regular intervals.  Problem though is that even then if you're somewhere with no signal you can't send a text ...

Do I remember you saying you had a usb power stick that'll recharge your phone?  If so you could always run Buddy Beacon with that connected to your phone, it's what I do when out with Search and Rescue so my phone doesn't struggle battery wise.   
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: taxino8 on 18:06:10, 18/12/18
I’d never really thought about this but I leave a printed copy of my route with my family and they know my expected times.
I also have an IPhone with Find Friends that allows them to see where I am but this is of course dependent on a signal to my phone.
Expensive but effective, or so I believe, is the Spot device that requires a yearly subscription but as it works on satellites and has a panic button it’s probably one of the best options if you are prepared to shell out a few quid.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Beth FF on 18:06:23, 18/12/18
Hi Beth, just twigged who you are  :)



And I only discovered today that you're on this forum!  :)
Yes, I have a USB power bank which I could use to charge my phone if required. I'm especially worried about phone signal when I get to the more remote areas. Will be starting the South West Coast Path in the New Year (then there's the Welsh coast!) so I need to feel confident I can summon help if I have to or that someone knows my exact location.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: ninthace on 18:08:52, 18/12/18
Another option would be Spot - not cheap though.
https://www.findmespot.com/en/spotemergency/
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: sussamb on 18:09:15, 18/12/18
And I only discovered today that you're on this forum!  :)

 ;D

Unfortunately as I said the only way to be sure would be something like InReach, which is rather expensive, a GPS simply receives a signal, it doesn't transmit anything  :(

When I'm solo walking I simply text when I can and when I have a signal giving my location, and with wherever I'm going knowing my route and roughly when I plan to arrive.  That way if I don't turn up on time at least whoever comes to find me knows roughly where to look  O0
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: ninthace on 18:24:23, 18/12/18
I do much the same - I text Mrs N with the name and time I pass a landmark.  She has a copy of my route.  If the conditions or the going are worse than expected I will add that information if it is likely to slow me down.
One cautionary tale - yesterday my ViewRanger app suddenly went very wrong.  When I checked my phone it had me 3/4 of a mile away from where I was and showed me not moving.  When I checked it again 10 min later it had jumped to a new location, still wrong, still not moving.  I had to restart my phone from cold to get it working again.  Meanwhile my faithful Garmin soldiered on as always.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: davengf on 18:38:06, 18/12/18
I still use map & compass for navigation when walking but I do use 'Grid Ref' (free android app) as a location/confidence checker  ::)  if I need to.
 It lets you copy a location to a text message which you can send to your friend/family/minder. Not ideal but the best simple solution I have found so far.
There are other apps out there that do something similar but none of them quite do what we really want them too


Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Maggot on 20:46:46, 18/12/18
I don't know who you are, but I am getting the feeling you are doing 'Something Significant'.  So why not tap into that and get sponsored by a company that sells these devices?  It could be a major coup for them to have someone walking a huge journey, they could map it, use it as a long term testbed or demo.  You get the idea.  Just a thought.


Or, if you want to go nice and cheap then think dog...... https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00F8A1ZBA/ref=asc_df_B00F8A1ZBA57546854/?tag=googshopuk-21&creative=22110&creativeASIN=B00F8A1ZBA&linkCode=df0&hvadid=309950281379&hvpos=1o4&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5530359228153880513&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1006739&hvtargid=pla-578440637272&th=1&psc=1


We use one on our Beagle, and it is only about a fiver a month and a £30 outlay.


I would try the sponsorship route though.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Owen on 20:48:43, 18/12/18
I have an inreach, I got it to carry on my solo trips to remote parts of Scandinavia. As already said it has a panic button which sends an SOS message to a control in the US, they then try to text you to find out what's wrong. This information is then past to the local rescue coordinators.
You get a webpage on their site - which you can control who has access. Anyone who does have access can go online and "ping you" i.e. track your latest position. You can vary the frequency of logged positions - there is a charge per logged point 10 cent I think. The default setting is every two minutes, I have mine set to every two hours.
You can send and receive text messages, if you use pre-set messages their free, but if you want to write one out then there is a small charge per message. I have "I'm setting off", "Just checking in everything's fine" and "back in civilization finished walking"  and one or two others as pre set messages. 
It just clips to you and you can forget about it. The battery will last for about a week between recharging, I use either a solar panel or a powerpack (Anker) device.
You can also get a weather forecast (very basic) and very basic maps so your device can be used as a basic GPS ( I have a better GPS so don't bother with this feature).
There is a monthly subscription charge from $18, you can suspend your subscription for month's you're not using your device. 


The SPOT is another very similar device, I'm not sure who own's them. Inreach is owned by Garmin.     
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Jac on 20:52:37, 18/12/18



A friend whose brother sadly is in the early stages of dementia has a tag through which the can access his location. It sounds a bit big brother (no pun intended)  but they have already had reason to be glad of it when he became disorientated.
Presumably it is something like this
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10029205/GPS-tags-for-dementia-patients.html


I've no idea if you can 'buy' one
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: sussamb on 20:54:28, 18/12/18

Or, if you want to go nice and cheap then think dog...... https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00F8A1ZBA/ref=asc_df_B00F8A1ZBA57546854/?tag=googshopuk-21&creative=22110&creativeASIN=B00F8A1ZBA&linkCode=df0&hvadid=309950281379&hvpos=1o4&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5530359228153880513&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1006739&hvtargid=pla-578440637272&th=1&psc=1 (https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00F8A1ZBA/ref=asc_df_B00F8A1ZBA57546854/?tag=googshopuk-21&creative=22110&creativeASIN=B00F8A1ZBA&linkCode=df0&hvadid=309950281379&hvpos=1o4&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5530359228153880513&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1006739&hvtargid=pla-578440637272&th=1&psc=1)


We use one on our Beagle, and it is only about a fiver a month and a £30 outlay.


I would try the sponsorship route though.


Still needs a mobile phone signal though  ;)
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: sussamb on 20:56:56, 18/12/18


A friend whose brother sadly is in the early stages of dementia has a tag through which the can access his location. It sounds a bit big brother (no pun intended)  but they have already had reason to be glad of it when he became disorientated.
Presumably it is something like this
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10029205/GPS-tags-for-dementia-patients.html (https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10029205/GPS-tags-for-dementia-patients.html)


I've no idea if you can 'buy' one


This too needs a mobile phone signal
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: BuzyG on 21:43:57, 18/12/18
It's worth noting that text signals require far less signal strength to operate than speech, over a mobile network.  Hence as with others I leave a copy of my route with my wife and text at a few key points along the way.  As I also use the OS app as my only GPS, I also avoid the expense and weight of a dedicated GPS.  Early versions used to drain my phone battery, however they have worked hard on sorting this and the current version runs all day on my old Samsung phone.  This assumes you are walking in the UK.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: ninthace on 22:00:10, 18/12/18
It's worth noting that text signals require far less signal strength to operate than speech, over a mobile network.  Hence as with others I leave a copy of my route with my wife and text at a few key points along the way.  As I also use the OS app as my only GPS, I also avoid the expense and weight of a dedicated GPS.  Early versions used to drain my phone battery, however they have worked hard on sorting this and the current version runs all day on my old Samsung phone.  This assumes you are walking in the UK.
  I have a Samsung phone and find that the OS app is not wholly reliable.  It sometimes refuses to find the gps at all or records for a while then just stops but, unlike my Garmin, it does not alarm if it loses the gps signal.  I'm happy to use it as a tertiary backup, ViewRanger being my second as it more reliable but both have banged out on me at one time or another so I stick to Garmin as number one.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: BuzyG on 22:26:04, 18/12/18
  I have a Samsung phone and find that the OS app is not wholly reliable.  It sometimes refuses to find the gps at all or records for a while then just stops but, unlike my Garmin, it does not alarm if it loses the gps signal.  I'm happy to use it as a tertiary backup, ViewRanger being my second as it more reliable but both have banged out on me at one time or another so I stick to Garmin as number one.

It has improved much since I started using it.  I agree though it is not perfect yet. Mine lost the plot, literally on Snowdon in poor visibility.  Happily my son's worked perfectly and I did get mine back and working after 15 mins of faffing, not ideal. It also  Indicate I was over a I'km of target once, on Dartmoor. Happily on a bright sunny day, so I just ignored it and restated my phone.

 I have not experienced any issues with the more recent versions though and I use it on every walk I do.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: richardh1905 on 07:33:25, 19/12/18

Hi again Beth.


As others have noted, many of the cheaper tracker systems use a mobile network, and clearly this is not an option if you are up around Cape Wrath, for instance- if you want total coverage you will have go stump up and pay for a GPS tracker system.


An alternative is to go for a PLB (Personal Locator Beacon). This is a GPS device that you activate if you are in trouble, but is NOT a tracker, however. Having said that, this is what I would consider, as they are bombproof, designed for use by mariners, and WILL work when you need it (I used to carry one when I was out in a RIB or helicopter visiting remote lighthouses). Also - there are no subscription charges. Cost is around £220.


http://www.mcmurdomarine.com/mcmurdo-products/mcmurdo-fastfind-220/ (http://www.mcmurdomarine.com/mcmurdo-products/mcmurdo-fastfind-220/)
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: richardh1905 on 07:35:14, 19/12/18

also, do register for the text 999 service, just in case.


https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/news/walkers-urged-to-register-for-999-text-service/002852/ (https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/news/walkers-urged-to-register-for-999-text-service/002852/)
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: jimbob on 13:14:09, 19/12/18
Just for clarity Richard, Viewranger does not use a mobile signal, it uses the same GPS satellites as a dedicated GPS unit. In fact if you want your battery to last using Viewranger you need to turn your phone signal off, I use airplane mode.  If you want to use buddy beacon then you do  need a phone signal and will suffer battery rundown  Which in a low signal area can be fast, whilst the phone is hunting for a signal.. But since a dedicated GPS (such as Etrex) cannot use phone networks then they are no use for the OPs notification requirement either. 

I have suffered serious battery problems with my phone mainly due to my own stupidity, I didn't flick the phone into airline mode.  I carry a 14w solar charger which is enough to keep a power pack charged up
I have read the above mentions of VR being off course at times, in three years minimum I have never experienced that EXCEPT in built up or forested areas. Strangely I found out why by reading the Garmin FAQs seemingly it can happen with them also in the same type of terrain.( In areas when you are walking in GPS shaded areas (valleys, gorges forests, densely wooded areas.etc)).
 I am sure Sussamb will be able to enlighten us further as he is an expert on all things GPS.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: richardh1905 on 17:19:55, 19/12/18
Thanks Jim - I was talking about cheap tracker systems, not Viewranger.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Maggot on 20:15:27, 19/12/18

Still needs a mobile phone signal though  ;)


But only barely.  The Tractive often works when our mobiles won't in the woods.  It only needs a tickle of a signal to work.



Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Maggot on 20:27:03, 19/12/18
Anyway, these things are really a bit of a red herring in terms of safety.  If something bad happened there only use really is so people know where to come and look for your body.


Especially if you have the ping set to a couple of hours!  You could reasonably expect to cover a good few miles in that time, that is a search diameter of maybe 10 or 12 miles, even more if you are walking the coast path and the tide is going out when you fall in  ;D
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: ninthace on 21:27:08, 19/12/18
Anyway, these things are really a bit of a red herring in terms of safety.  If something bad happened there only use really is so people know where to come and look for your body.


Especially if you have the ping set to a couple of hours!  You could reasonably expect to cover a good few miles in that time, that is a search diameter of maybe 10 or 12 miles, even more if you are walking the coast path and the tide is going out when you fall in  ;D
A Spot unit will update  your position at predetermined intervals so it can be as current as you choose it to be.  Typically a ping could be every 10 or 20 min but bigger the gap, the longer the battery life.  It does not require a mobile signal to work.  It was 2 signal buttons, one can be set send a predetermined "all's well" message, say at at the end of the day; the second calls for help giving your current location.  It is used by the military on exercises or to track participants in endurance events.  I have used it to track a friend walking the length of the Pyrenees.  I think it is also used by participants in the Spine Race, perhaps someone could confirm?
If you stop moving without triggering the alarm it will give your current position so any search could fairly quick to execute but perhaps delayed in its start.  If you are conscious and hit the panic button, the search should start at once.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Owen on 22:48:48, 19/12/18
Anyway, these things are really a bit of a red herring in terms of safety.  If something bad happened there only use really is so people know where to come and look for your body.


Especially if you have the ping set to a couple of hours!  You could reasonably expect to cover a good few miles in that time, that is a search diameter of maybe 10 or 12 miles, even more if you are walking the coast path and the tide is going out when you fall in  ;D


Far from it, I can contact people back at home and tell them whether I'm alright or not. I can also call for help by pressing the SOS panic button. If I'd needed to do this I'd hardly continue walking so I wouldn't have covered 10 or 12 miles, I'd be sitting waiting right where the device says I am.


If I'd fallen down and couldn't press the button I wouldn't be able to walk away either, so the pinger would continue to report my position as not moving.   
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Wurz on 23:28:56, 19/12/18
No advice on spot devices but a bit of reassurance.  On the SWCP at any time of the year apart from after dark you will rarely be far from other people.  Even midweek in winter it is very popular with locals and dog walkers as well as tourists.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: richardh1905 on 08:38:59, 20/12/18
Especially if you have the ping set to a couple of hours!  You could reasonably expect to cover a good few miles in that time, that is a search diameter of maybe 10 or 12 miles, even more if you are walking the coast path and the tide is going out when you fall in  ;D



You're not thinking this through, Maggot. If someone were to be incapacitated, the unit would continue to 'Ping' from their static location.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: taxino8 on 09:20:36, 20/12/18
Does anyone use a HF or UHF radio and can they contact emergency services with it?
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: fernman on 09:35:16, 20/12/18
As I'm not getting any younger and I walk on my own in remote areas, this thread has got me thinking I should install a phone app that I could use to send my location to someone if I had a serious problem.

Those I've looked at briefly at this stage all show your position in latitude and longitude. Is that OK for the UK emergency services, or do they want OS grid references?
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: richardh1905 on 10:01:30, 20/12/18



I'm sure that they could work with lat and long, fernman


But you need to ask yourself - if you are going to 'remote areas', can you guarantee a phone signal?
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: richardh1905 on 10:03:17, 20/12/18
Does anyone use a HF or UHF radio and can they contact emergency services with it?



We used to carry handheld marine band VHF radios when I worked on lighthouses, but you need a license and they are not really intended for land use.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: ninthace on 10:50:19, 20/12/18

We used to carry handheld marine band VHF radios when I worked on lighthouses, but you need a license and they are not really intended for land use.
Isn’t VHF pretty much line of sight anyway so of limited value. Also for it to work, someone has to be listening. The unlicensed devices once loved by skiers before the invention of mobiles had a very short range, 2km tops, and could not be tuned to the Guard frequency.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: ninthace on 10:52:28, 20/12/18
As I'm not getting any younger and I walk on my own in remote areas, this thread has got me thinking I should install a phone app that I could use to send my location to someone if I had a serious problem.

Those I've looked at briefly at this stage all show your position in latitude and longitude. Is that OK for the UK emergency services, or do they want OS grid references?
From previous discussions on this forum the emergency services seem to want a post code!
http://www.walkingforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=14209.0 (http://www.walkingforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=14209.0)
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: alan de enfield on 11:45:16, 20/12/18
Isn’t VHF pretty much line of sight anyway so of limited value. Also for it to work, someone has to be listening. The unlicensed devices once loved by skiers before the invention of mobiles had a very short range, 2km tops, and could not be tuned to the Guard frequency.



Putting aside the legality of transmitting without a licence.


Yes - VHF is 'line of sight' but  can easily achieve 20+ miles from my boat - the sea is pretty flat and line of sight is as far as the horizon, and even further if the receiving aerial is at the top of a mast.


Marine VHF is on FM. Channel 16 is the calling channel and any ships will monitor it (although DSC is now more commonly used)
The same 'radio' can be programmed to cover all of the SAR (Search & Rescue) frequencies for bot Land & Sea


The international 'Guard Channel' of 121.5Mhz is on AM and cannot be used on the same radio as the Marine channels.
EPIRBs on 406Mhz have pretty much replaced the 121.5Mhz channel.
You can get a personal EPIRB (which needs to be registered) which in the event of an emergency, push the button and a satellite will pick up the signal from anywhere in the world.
The satellite then notifies 'your country of registration emergency services', who notify your 'next of kin' and commences searching.


The Epirb is a 'one off purchase with no additional annual licencing or usage costs'


Just one example


https://www.aspli.com/2119/plb-rescue-me1-personal-locator-beacon/?gclid=CjwKCAiAmO3gBRBBEiwA8d0Q4rin7CCwYhKQ789q2wjhEy7fshXoM2iydQa0kjTW77RKR4yPJc0v3RoC2sgQAvD_BwE (https://www.aspli.com/2119/plb-rescue-me1-personal-locator-beacon/?gclid=CjwKCAiAmO3gBRBBEiwA8d0Q4rin7CCwYhKQ789q2wjhEy7fshXoM2iydQa0kjTW77RKR4yPJc0v3RoC2sgQAvD_BwE)
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Owen on 12:30:57, 20/12/18
HF sets are big and heavy and need lots of power. They do have range - world wide if you know how but that requires an equally big antenna. I've used them Kenya to UK and Falkland Islands to UK but I think the Army use satellite technology these days.


UHF is similar to mobile phones with the same limitations.


VHF even on the hills has a limited range, especially handheld sets.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: ninthace on 12:33:30, 20/12/18
Thanks Alan - very instructive.  I never had much luck with the radios we were issued with for diving.   In fact I did suggest we could improve the range by tying a chinagraph pencil to the aerial and sticking some white fablon to the back of the radio.  That way we could write a message on the plastic and throw the radio to the recipient!
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: fernman on 13:06:43, 20/12/18
Thanks Richard and Ninthace for your comments on my query about using lat and long (where is Sussamb today, he might have something to say!).

Agreed a phone signal is unlikely in remote parts of north Wales where I go, it's something I'd have to take a chance on, one always needs to make compromises. But the closer areas in Bucks, Oxon and Herts where I walk have some "remote" spots in woods etc. where no-one might pass for days, and these places do have a phone signal.

As for needing postcodes, that is third world Britain beurocratic nonsense, I can't imagine anyone away from home or work would have a clue what it is, especially in the middle of the countryside.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: ninthace on 13:32:02, 20/12/18
Perhaps this will give you some hope Fernman https://www.ruralnetwork.scot/news-and-events/news/emergency-services-encourage-use-location-apps
I have no doubt the Coastguard and MRTs can use grid refs!  I suspect the problem lies with ambulances using sat navs to get to a call, car sat navs don't do grid ref (at least mine doesn't).
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: alan de enfield on 13:46:25, 20/12/18
Thanks Alan - very instructive.  I never had much luck with the radios we were issued with for diving.   In fact I did suggest we could improve the range by tying a chinagraph pencil to the aerial and sticking some white fablon to the back of the radio.  That way we could write a message on the plastic and throw the radio to the recipient!



Just as a follow-up.
The VHF I carry with me is capable (and programmed) for :
All marine frequencies
All Coastguard frequencies
All UK SAR (Land & Sea) frequencies
Amateur (Ham) 2 metre (144Mhz) channels

All PMR446 ('walkie-talkie') UHF Frequencies


Edit to add :
Forgot to mention that this radio transceiver also include a 'standard' VHF receiver (music, news, etc channels), an LED torch and a very bright 'strobe light' to assist rescuers in finding you.
I have used 'radio' for many, many years and DX'd all over the world but I'm really impressed with the features that this little radio offers for a 'pocket-money' price.

Cost of the Radio Transceiver was £13* + £3 for a programming cable. Comes with a 1800Mah battery as standard but I have changed that out to a 2700Mah at a cost of £9. Added at 'better' (longer) aerial that gives (allegedly) a 3.0Db gain - cost £1.40
Battery charged via USB cable from my 'power-pack'.


Weight of radio including 'extended' battery = 240 grams (8 oz)



* There was a 'price war' going on so I bought several whilst they were on 'offer'. They are normally about £18-£20


I am a 'lapsed' Ham (G3LCR), and have both a marine VHF operators licence and an Aircraft VHF operators licence.
However I should point out that the radio is 'illegal' for transmitting (except in an emergency) as it works on multiple frequencies so is not 'type-approved'.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: sussamb on 15:25:16, 20/12/18
I suspect the problem lies with ambulances using sat navs to get to a call, car sat navs don't do grid ref (at least mine doesn't).


Most modern satnavs and definitely all Garmin ones do grid refs.  Our ambulance control centres can also cope with grid refs  O0
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: sussamb on 15:29:59, 20/12/18
Thanks Richard and Ninthace for your comments on my query about using lat and long (where is Sussamb today, he might have something to say!).


Away on holiday with patchy comms and my phone so don't expect much from me  ;D
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: richardh1905 on 15:54:13, 20/12/18
Isn’t VHF pretty much line of sight anyway so of limited value. Also for it to work, someone has to be listening. The unlicensed devices once loved by skiers before the invention of mobiles had a very short range, 2km tops, and could not be tuned to the Guard frequency.



Correct. Channel 16 for Coastguard (and all ships) - they are always listening. But for mariners.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: richardh1905 on 16:01:22, 20/12/18
The Epirb is a 'one off purchase with no additional annual licencing or usage costs'



Sorry to be pedantic, Alan, but a PLB (Personal Locator Beacon) is what would be appropriate for a hillwalker, not an EPIRB, which is registered to a vessel. Although they pretty much do the same job.


http://epirb.com/difference_between_EPIRBs_PLBs.php (http://epirb.com/difference_between_EPIRBs_PLBs.php)
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: alan de enfield on 16:25:56, 20/12/18

Correct. Channel 16 for Coastguard (and all ships) - they are always listening. But for mariners.




It all changed several years ago - they no longer keep a 'listening watch' on Ch16. It is still 'switched on' but does not have a dedicated person sat with ear-phones on keeping a Ch16 'watch'.
I mentioned this in Post #34

It now relies on someone actually 'noticing the call' as all emergency traffic is now via DSC(Digital Selective Calling)


Channel 70 is the DSC channel and automatically transmits the boats location, name and number with a simple 'press of a button'. Voice transmission on channel 70 is forbidden,

A VHF radio will enable you to summon help by calling the Coastguard and alerting other vessels. Up until recently this was done with a mayday call on Ch16. However, the Global Maritime Distress and Safety System (GMDSS) has changed. There is no longer a legal requirement for any ship or coast station to maintain a manual watch on Ch16. The UK Coastguard and Irish Coast Guard have ceased a dedicated Ch16 headset watch and now monitor this via a wall-mounted loudspeaker. Please check with other countries if going abroad.


Instead, commercial ships and the Coastguard now monitor a special digital channel with DSC radios.


Source : RNLI Website


There have been several other changes in 2017 with the revised frequencies for the safety channels'


(https://i.postimg.cc/627Dp70k/WEB-VHF-Channel-changes-286x400.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/627Dp70k)






Further changes come into effect in early 2019 with some of the Duplex frequencies being 'split' to give additional Simplex channels


For example Channel 20 will be split into channel 1020 and channel 2020 utilising each half of the Duplex frequencies.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Owen on 18:06:30, 20/12/18
Wandering away from the subject a bit aren't we?
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: ninthace on 18:27:27, 20/12/18
I have the answer Beth!  Get 2 tin cans and some string.  Attach one end of the string to the base of a tin can and give it to someone you trust.  Set off on your walk maintaining a decent tension on the string as you go. If you get into difficulties, cut the string and attach it to the base of the other tin.  Now give the string a couple of sharp tugs to attract your friend's attention then yell your message into the tin.  That way your friend will know what's wrong and if they follow the string they will be able to find you.  Low cost, no phone app, no batteries needed, no phone signal required, no radio operator's certificate required, what could possibly go wrong?
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: richardh1905 on 19:15:54, 20/12/18
Thanks for the clarification, Alan. Things have obviously moved on.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Beth FF on 17:18:58, 21/12/18

Wow, thanks for all the replies! My options seem to be:


1.  Send regular texts to someone, saying where I am. Needs a mobile signal though.
2. Pay for something like Garmin InReach, which relies on signals via satellite rather than mobile phone masts
3. Use a Spot device. It requires a yearly subscription but as it works on satellites and has a panic button
4. Get a dog tracker eg Tractive Dog GPS Tracker. But needs a mobile signal
5. Go for a Personal Locator Beacon which I can activate if I'm in trouble.
6. Use Viewranger buddy beacon and have battery pack backups.


My main concern is getting into difficulties and not having a phone signal to get help. I’ve been in places where even texts don’t send, so relying on my mobile makes me rather uncomfortable, as does battery drain. I can see the merits of sending regular texts though as it’s the simplest solution. Good to hear that I can expect to encounter people on the SWCP, even in poor weather/the winter, because some areas are many miles from the nearest road.


I don't know who you are, but I am getting the feeling you are doing 'Something Significant'.  So why not tap into that and get sponsored by a company that sells these devices?
I suppose I am doing something pretty big, I’m walking the coast of Britain to raise awareness and funds for the RNLI and Lowland Rescue. I gave up my home and started walking from Tower RNLI station, Westminster on 3rd October and have walked continuously since, covering the coast of Kent, Sussex, Hampshire, the Isle of Wight, and Dorset up to Poole. Getting sponsorship would be ideal so I’ll try your suggestion.


I have the answer Beth!  Get 2 tin cans and some string...
Nailed it!  ;D
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: taxino8 on 12:49:17, 22/12/18
So this thread has got me thinking that I might need one of these, I’m a fit 60 year old but you never know if you’ve got something about to give in on you at this age and maybe I should get one as I tend to walk solo, mainly in the North Lakes.
Of course you aren’t usually far from people walking there and there is some mobile coverage, particularly if you are high up.


That’s got me looking at the Spot X and both of the Garmin InReach models.
So which one do I go for (if I decided to go ahead) as there are many conflicting reviews about each and every one?
Cost isn’t really an important factor I just want to know if they work effectively.


Can anyone who owns one of these devices tell me the pros and cons of their own particular device.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: jimbob on 13:05:37, 22/12/18
So actually what do the Spine racers use.
They seem to be proven technology.

Can they be used by individuals? Or are they only for mass usage?

Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: ninthace on 13:28:33, 22/12/18
I may be wrong but I think 10 Tors use Spot.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: Owen on 15:07:44, 22/12/18


Can anyone who owns one of these devices tell me the pros and cons of their own particular device.


I have the InReach SE,


Pro's,
Two way text communications.
SOS alert.
Route tracking.
Reasonably long battery life between charging.
UBS battery charging.


Con's
Expensive.
Needs a subscription but this can be suspended when not in use. 
Extra weight. 240g, + Anker powerpack 197g, Solar panel ~ 300g.


Whether you really need one for the North Lakes is up to you.
Title: Re: Safety whilst coastal walking alone - GPS device or ViewRanger BuddyBeacon?
Post by: taxino8 on 15:41:51, 22/12/18

I have the InReach SE,


Pro's,
Two way text communications.
SOS alert.
Route tracking.
Reasonably long battery life between charging.
UBS battery charging.


Con's
Expensive.
Needs a subscription but this can be suspended when not in use. 
Extra weight. 240g, + Anker powerpack 197g, Solar panel ~ 300g.


Whether you really need one for the North Lakes is up to you.
Thanks for your info, it all helps.
I’m a bit of a gadget nut too so I can see me buying something like this in the New Year but I’d like to get the one that is the most reliable.