Outdoor shops

[romaway]

I have only just started walking and have joined the ramblers as I am on my own and prefer to walk in a group.  I am not a youngster and so am taking it gently. 

I am aiming to build up my strength and get up to the lake district one day for a holiday.  I have now done a few 12 mile walks in slightly hilly areas and will be walking twice weekly with the Ramblers.

I have no proper clothing and I find that my cheap bog standard kagoule was absolutely soaking inside after just a brief walk, I was hot and took it off and of course could not put it on again wet, so got cold for a little time.  Was not a major problem as  this was not too cold a day and I was not anywhere more than 5 mins from civilisation.

It has highlighted though that I do need to get a decent jacket, trousers and pullover (my lovely fashionable manmade fabric jumper was not the best to wear).

My question is : 

Am I likely to get everything I need with correct advice from the hight street stores like Millets and Blacks or are there better high street stores in London area.  ( I  don't want to use internet).

Thank you

[buzz7639]

I use decathlon for some of my outdoor gear, they have an their brand which i find grat for all but the worst weather, hope this helps, they have a web site and store location section

[mike knipe]

Millets and Blacks are the same company - and Blacks sell slightly more up-market stuff than Millets.
I would have thought you'd be able to buy something breathable enough, and get reasonable advice from either shop. You can pay lots of dosh for jackets which often dont perform all that much better than something a bit more reasonably priced with a Gelert tag on it (in my opinion) So-called climbing shops are not averse to telling you a load of old dingo's kidneys about kit, sometimes to get a sale and sometimes because the assistant hasnt really got much of a clue and only works Saturdays!
Ive got both Paramo and Mountain equipment jackets and they're both pretty expensive and not immune to some condensation. (Paramo's better cos it has loads of zips for ventilation)
Whatever you buy, you have to keep it clean for it to be waterproof and reproof it from time to time or you'll eventually get wet. You can buy the stuff from wherever you buy the jackets. Whatever you do, though, dont wash a caggy in detergent as the detergent molecules stay in the fabric and they're designed to attract water! This will make your jacket un-waterproof (if thats a word!!) Use soapflakes or the proprietry stuff such as Nikwax.

[tonyk]

 In my experience the staff in both Milletts and Black's are useless.They will tell you anything to get a sale and its debatable if any of them have been anywhere near a park let alone in the mountains.Far better to get advice off a forum such as this and when you go to the shop you have a clear idea of what you need.At one time Black's was a good shop staffed by people who knew their stuff but these days they seem to employ any kid who is prepared to work for the minimum wage.

 I usually wear a Buffalo jacket and nothing else apart from very lightweight trousers.I get soaked when it rains but usually dry off within an hour.The bufflao jacket is designed to dry out on you.

 http://www.buffalosystems.co.uk/lsthumbs.htm

[mike knipe]

I have an acquaintance who works for Blacks and I have to say that he has quite a lot of experience (several TGO Challenges, for instance) and doesnt work for minimum wage, isnt a "kid" and would find Tonyk's suggestion that staff at Blacks dont know what their doing and will tell you anything just to get a sale a serious insult.   

[muymalestado]

romaway, where are you?  In Scotland the big beast is Tiso; in all the bigger cities.  Staff are doers t so know themselves what is what - but never that far from encouraging that wallet out of your pocket - not cheapest.  Craigdon are in a few high streets as well, and staff seem to have done lots out there and up there.

At best, getting started is like anything else; you'll get some things right, some not, and time will tell you which is which.  Trick is to enjoy the process out there in rain and shine.

[tonyk]

I have an acquaintance who works for Blacks and I have to say that he has quite a lot of experience (several TGO Challenges, for instance) and doesnt work for minimum wage, isnt a "kid" and would find Tonyk's suggestion that staff at Blacks dont know what their doing and will tell you anything just to get a sale a serious insult.   

  My comments are based on my experiences with our local Blacks.The majority of the staff are eighteen or younger,especially those employed on a Saturday.

[mike knipe]

I expect that some shops are better than others.  My local one is OK. My pal tried to buy crampons at a well-known mountain equipment shop in Newcastle and the assistant had no idea what he was talking about, despite the fact that pairs of crampons were hanging up just next to his left ear.

[romaway]

thanks so far all of you.

I am in  North London and went out today to Millets and Blacks who both sold the same jackets.  I tried one on and it seemed fine but it was a berghaus and £80.

The managers in both were very helpful and said probably rightly 'you get what you pay for' and 'berghaus is probably better than their generic John Storm for breathableness'

I just did not think there was much choice from their stock only  about 2 in my size and I looked like a policewoman in the one for £80!

I have looked on internet though at the outdoor stockists and am horrified at the starting prices of between £100 and £300. OK huge reductions but only to about minimum £80ish'.

I am just beginning to realise that like any other hobby the prices are really inflated.  Well never mind, even though I am no spring chicken to be starting this lark,  I intend to get my money's worth so will visit a few more stores around the area, and then decide on my all important jacket.

I am walking with the Ramblers on Sunday so may also ask advice from more seasoned folk than me about local shops.

[howardfernlover]

I would not place much reliance on the staff of Central London outdoors supplies stores.  Because it's darn nigh impossible for anyone to live in or around London on a shop assistant's wages, the stores are desperate to take anyone on, consequently the posts are largely filled by people from all over the world, particularly Eastern Europe.  Sometimes they're keen, more often they're not, but what is particularly lacking, apart from a complete command of our language, is any real knowledge about the goods they're ringing up on the till.

There's a large store next to a big supermarket in a Buckinghamshire town, where I looked when I wanted some new boots.  I spent 15 minutes looking at every boot on display, while the two middle aged female assistants leaned against the counter nattering, as if I was invisible.  I then felt that even if they did approach me, or if I approached them, I wouldn't get the advice I needed, so I then drove around the M25 to Cotswold in St Albans, where the guy was excellent.  He asked what sort of walking I did and where, he measured my feet, and sold me a pair of boots that I have been really happy with.

As for Millets, I wouldn't shop in there again.  I couldn't see what I wanted, a kid asked if he could help, so I asked, "Where's your NikWax please?"  He looked blank, another person asked him what I wanted and the kid just shrugged his shoulders.  He may have been new, he may not have been familiar with the products, but I would have expected him to be capable of repeating the simple two-syllable word I had asked for.

So, I don't know which side of London you're on, but my advice is get your Yellow Pages out and head out of town where I think you'll get proper advice.  If you're on my side, the north (I don't know about south of the Thames, I don't cross the river!) there's a few scattered around Hertfordshire, particularly St Albans for example.  Good luck!

[howardfernlover]

I remember another Milletts experience.  I wanted a cheap pair of HiTecs for general kicking about in. My local branch had a big display of them on a table near the front of the shop, you couldn't miss them. Trouble was, there were no prices, so when someone came up and said, "You alright there?" I picked a boot up and asked how much please, just a casual enquiry like. Well, they hadn't a clue, it ended up with two assistants punching different codes into the till, with a third looking on. They were still at it by the time I'd had a browse around and left the store.

Undeterred, I looked another day in a different branch, where the footwear was displayed on shelves up the rear wall of the shop. One that seemed alright was out of reach, and as the staff were all serving people, I opened up their alluminium stepladder and took the boot down. While I was looking at it, a girl came up to me, and gave me a right rollicking for using the steps! She may have been right that customers shouldn't do that for safety reasons, but diplomacy was certainly not one of her skills.

Guess what, I bought a pair on the Internet, and they were cheaper too.

[romaway]

Well I got well and truly soaked today but only for last 10 mins or so of a lovely walk in the Chilterns.

Anyway I am off to the Galleria tomorrow as apparently there are three outdoor shops and I have had a look at the prices and they seem reasonable in Regatta.

OH has also informed me that he has a pair of showerproof trousers that I bought him years ago and I am off to the depths of the wardrobe to try and find them as they may fit me or may be reasonable fit.

Now bearing in mind I still have some garments I wore in the 60's, what is the betting I find them!!!

Just the jacket now to buy!!!

Thanks for all your help.

I have to say that the young manager chap I spoke to in Blacks told me he was a hillwalker who had lived all his childhood in the lakes and he was really helpful to me and gave me lots of tips, just not very good stock available.

[howardfernlover]

Doh!  I never thought of the Galleria!  I ought to look there for the waterproof overtrousers I want in green or olive (see my angst-filled messages on the subject, on the Gear board). 
For the benefit of forum members who live in other parts of the UK, the Galleria is a large shopping mall on the A1 at Hatfield in Hertfordshire - literally on the A1, which passes under it in a tunnel.  It was not a success as a general shopping mall, so it was relaunched as a "Retail Outlet Centre", which means it is filled entirely with shops selling their end-of-lines and surplus stock at reduced prices (allegedly), and amongst those shops are at least three outdoor shops, as romaway rightly points out.  Thanks for reminding me, mate!

[yetanotherben]

....shopping online isn't that bad, surely?!  It's where I get my gear, anyway...

[howardfernlover]

In my opinion it's OK for hardware and sundries, Ben, but a bit iffy for clothing because you need to know exactly what it's like first, plus you can't be too sure it's going to fit you ok - unless you've already been in a shop, seen the exact model you want, had a good look at it and tried it on, which isn't really fair on the shop, is it, unless you've got no scruples.

I bought a Berghaus jacket for general wear a few years ago, cost three figures, very high spec, it looked the business.  I wore it that evening, and froze!  It simply wasn't warm enough for me.  I took it straight back to the shop, they were very good about it, and I swapped it for a ski jacket.  Now, if I'd have bought that online, based on the description and the specifications, I'd have been up the creek, think of the hassle involved, sending it back, getting a refund, etc.

I'll now give you an example of sizing.  I bought a pair of Royal Robbins shorts in Medium size.  So light and comfortable, lovely to wear in hot weather.  Liked them so much that I went to buy a second pair the next year, in a different colour.  Would you believe, I could only just about do the Medium ones up around my waist, and I had to buy a Large pair.  And before you jump to conclusions, no it wasn't me that was getting fatter, because the original Medium pair still fitted me perfectly!