Walking Forum
Main Boards => General Walking Discussion => Topic started by: gunwharfman on 14:51:18, 28/05/19
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I'm a hiker who finds that camping costs me between £40 to £50 a day and on odd days even more. I will always try to look for a campsite and will often pay £10 for a night. I then go to pubs to eat and drink, three pints can be about £12 and about £12-£15 for a meal. Then, of course, I will buy snacks to eat during the day plus coffee and cake. Easily another £10. Is this your type of experience, or do you hike and camp more cheaply?
I would save lots of money if I wild camped each time and I assume I would save again if I cooked food myself? Can't really think of much else.
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I'm the same. I've never wild camped, and can easily spend £50 per day. I'm not one for sitting by or inside my tent at night, and would much rather eat, drink and socialise in the nearest pub.
Some people prefer the solitude. It's a personal choice.
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Easy to cut those costs but, forgive me if I'm wrong, but I don't get the impression that you really want to give up anything to do so.
I can never quite understand carrying a tent then paying to pitch it unless access to a shower is important though perhaps if you spend each evening in a pub it is.
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Assuming you're not setting off from home, you left out transport to / from the walk :) .
But if that's the way you like to do it, and you can afford it, then why not? You're right, obviously, that it can be a great deal cheaper if you wild camp and cook - only a little more per day than you would probably have spent on food if you'd stayed at home, in fact. If you haven't tried it like that then maybe you should - lying in my sleeping bag of an evening, looking across an empty glen and listening to the silence, while water for a meal starts bubbling on my stove, is one of the main attractions of camping for me. But I quite understand that other people like to do it differently.
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I've got two tents, but hardly ever use them. They are too heavy to carry, so it would be camping with my car. I did think about booking myself on a camp site for this last trip down the south west, I don't mind sleeping in a tent. But, I don't need to holiday on the cheap any more so I thought blow that for a game of soldiers, and booked a nice B & B for five nights, and went in a Travelodge for the last night.
There's no way I would sit in a pub every night, I don't need a cooked meal and several pints. My weight would balloon if I did that. I'm not a pubby person, don't even go in the local at home, and it's just round the corner.
If I slept in a tent I would get the cooker on and warm up some soup.
ilona
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if you wild camp and cook - only a little more per day than you would probably have spent on food if you'd stayed at home, in fact.
If you haven't tried it like that then maybe you should -
Exactly - there is no such thing a free food (unless you scrump it) all food costs money so no need to pay more than you can afford.
The walking is freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee :D
I'm pretty sure GWM has tried it which is why I don't quite understand why he's raised the question.
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In a nutshell, its the food and booze that makes your daily costs higher than other peoples. £12 on booze £12-£15 on food, approx £25 a day on luxuries. yes you may miss out on the social side of things in the pub but I often find, conversations with other campers around fires on the campsite are more interesting.
And just cooking your own meal once every few days would save you money. What do you do if there is no pub? Or do you only stay at campsites near pubs?
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I raised the question because I'm just interested in how others do it. I didn't include travel costs, that adds to it all of course but obviously is variable depending on where one goes and by what transport system is used. I have wild camped quite a lot, not because I've deliberately planned to do so, more about being in the wrong place at the end of the day. I do like going to pubs and when in them I make a great effort to talk to people, especially to the ones who live nearby or in the area. My question came about because I was talking to a young bloke in the pub a few days ago and we discussed costs. He couldn't believe it at first, he thought camping was an ultra cheap way of having some time away. I'm lucky that I'm of an age when I don't really have to worry about cost anymore, but my lifes habit of not being wayward with money is hard to change.
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Excluding travel to/from and campsite costs, my camping expenses are zero.
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Maybe it’s just me but when I do a backpacking walk, the last thing I want to do is sit in a noisy pub. If there’s a shop near or on the way I’d rather just buy a pack of 4 cans (to re-hydrate myself ;)) and enjoy the peace and quiet plus food from the shop.
If no shop then there’s not much option than have a pub meal and a pint then back to the peace and quiet of my tent.
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This thread has prompted me to do a rough calculation of my daily food costs plus sundries like batteries, etc., for a four-day walk, so I added up all the stuff I'd ordered online such as freeze-dried meals, isotonic drink powder amd energy bars plus supermarket items like dried milk, packet soups and chocolate.
The total worked out as £14 per day for the trip I completed a couple of weeks ago. I wild camped, so costs for this were zero.
How this compares with how much my food costs at home I haven't a clue, ask the wife, I'd guess £14 is slightly more.
As for pubs, there aren't any where I walk (I tell a lie, I did pass one this year where I spent £3.50 on a pint, my excuse being it was very hot weather, but that was a highly unusual exception, and I didn't like having the weight of the coins in change from my banknote afterwards).
Post-walk I stayed on a remarkably cheap camp site at £6 per night (I'm used to paying £14-15 and up to £20), while pub lunch with a pint and pub dinner with a pint came to about £30 a day. Living like that is a luxury for me, I can't afford to drink out or dine out at home except for a rare Wetherspoons visit.
So neither were anything like other peoples' £40-50 a day.
Petrol for the 220 miles journey to my walk, plus driving around during my camp ste days, then returning home, was £75.
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I was talking to a young bloke in the pub a few days ago and we discussed costs. He couldn't believe it at first, he thought camping was an ultra cheap way of having some time away.
I think we've proved that it can be. It's the optional extras that up the cost - as in the rest of life.
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Lets be fair, camping is a cheap form of taking a holiday not nothing is 'free'. Food and travel are minimum costs which need to be seen more as an 'overhead' to even getting out of the door, but most of the things mentioned by the OP are what I'd consider a 'luxury' - a nice campsite with a shower and a pub dinner and a couple of pints aren't an 'every night' thing. If you're adding coffee stops, cake, pub dinners etc then I'm not surprised it's costing you more.
Some suggestions may be to only use a camp site every few days to keep yourself clean, same as buying food at supermarkets and carrying it with you - and a couple of beers if you want to enjoy the sunset with a drink or two. As for a pub meal, perhaps have one at the end of your walk and that is about it? If you really want to have coffee whilst out, some companies do decent backpacking drip coffee which you can have in the middle of the fells no problem. That's 2/3rds of your daily costs gone straight away, something which may let you take longer trips.
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Daily costs on a walk such as the Cleveland Way usually average around £15.This includes four pitches on campsites where the price varies from between £2 and £9 per night.Rest of the time is spent wild camping.Food is usually from the shops as living on my own I know full well how much it costs to prepare decent meals,certainly not £10-15 per portion.Its possible to eat quite well when walking for around £7 or less per day.I do visit pubs for a quick pint when the weather is hot but am quite happy to go without alcohol for long periods,often months at a time.
Its horses for courses.If you have the money and enjoy what you are doing then keep on doing it.An austere lifestyle isn't suitable for everyone.
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Conundrum;
What connects GWM's camping costs to shooting pheasants? £45. About the average a gun pays a shoot to eachdriven pheasant out of the air.
And the difference? Pheasants have a close season and walkers do all the year round. So which is economically more useful. A sport limited to the more wealthy or that open to all.
Probably a good thing to be proud of the money spent in the rural economy, farmers like to think money, but they are told by landowners that walkers are an unnecessary nuisance in the business of land management.
Thanks to the OP for drawing this point to my attention, next time I am talking to a farmer and he labours the point that the countryside is a workplace, I'll slip another bullet up the spout ;D
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BWW - playing Devils Advocate here, thinking how your farmer may respond. How much of the £45 per pheasant does the farmer get? When I walk the local publican may get some cash and the village hall car park may get some cash too but all the farmer gets is my bootprints and, if he invests any cash in path maintenance, he is actually paying for my bootprints. Does he get any income from having a PROW across his land?
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Does he get any income from having a PROW across his land?
We never did - all we got was broken fences, a frequently broken stile and gates left open allowing the horses to get out onto the road.
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Sounds more like the kneejerk reply of the landowner and not the farmer. But a the farming lobby has chosen to take a low profile in this debate the more informed contribution based on fact has failed to surface.
For 20-30 years the farming press has been promoting diversification but the potentially most powerful asset for diversification has been ridiculed by the landowner.
Being all in favour of a bit of Devilish Advocacy, I wonder if the fact that the land RoWs are on is removed from the calculations SFS are based on has been related to the potential earning power RoWs indicate in Natural England's own surveys.
I'm all for questioning the ascendancy of the pheasants profile in the rural hierarchy for the sake of upsetting a few established notions :D ,
if it starts to throw a bit of light into the darker places the CLA want to stay hidden.
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Costs can be cut as has been shown.
But I also tend to think having read many of GWM topics that he loves the way he does it and is only looking to see if he has missed something obvious.
My impression is that he has no obvious way of cutting back without changing the way he enjoys doing what he does.However, given the calories in a pint of bitter, maybe he should have two more pints and give the meal a miss😃😃😃😃
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I'm one of those very lucky people that I never really have to worry about my weight, but I think you are right. I like the way I hike, the pubs I visit and so on so no changes for me I'm afraid. I might this year do a bit more wild camping, as long as its near a pub of course! :)
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I like both.
Nothing like really getting out into the wilds and camping in the middle of nowhere, but there is also nothing like pitching on a decent campsite, going for a good long walk and retiring to a Lake District pub for a pint or three with friends.
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A pint (or two) after a good long hike always seems to taste better, although the first one may not touch the sides on the way down.
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Our evening meal when we wild camp costs £2.14. That is for both of us too ;D
We have our version of spaghetti Bolognese, made from dried noodles and Beanfeast. We also have packet soup and crisps and curried noodles. The noodles for the spag bol cost 50p, Beanfeast is £1, Tesco curried noodles 14p, soup 30p, crisps 20p. No cooking as such is involved just boil water and pour it on and let it hydrate.
The wine isn't included in that but we pay less than £5 per bottle as a rule.
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If I'm only going away for a night or two I just take some food out of the kitchen, so it only cost me the amount of gas used to cook it. I'd have eaten the food anyway so it's not an extra cost beyond normal living costs.
If I'm away for a longer wilderness walk I take dried food which cost extra. I normally buy a few packets at a time to spread the cost out this way I hardly notice it. I hardly ever take booze and I'm not one for pubs but might have the odd bottle of beer at the end of a trip.
Now that I'm over 60 I can use my bus pass in Scotland, this makes it easy to do liner walks and costs me nothing. Works on the ferries as well but not in Englandshire. Unfortunately flights to Scandinavia do cost me and they aren't cheap.
Don't tend to do car camping anymore so hardly ever use sites, so again no cost.
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If you enjoy the way you do it and have the money why worry. We're all different.
I only camp when there's no camping barn or hostel ect where we usually cook our own. I take vegetables off my allotment that I've dried myself pasta and rice and pulses. Costs about £20 a day with the odd cake or icecream thrown in.
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A pint (or two) after a good long hike always seems to taste better, although the first one may not touch the sides on the way down.
The optimum time for me is when I have one pint inside me and the second on the table in front of me.
..after that, it's all downhill! :D
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Wild camping really does cost next to nothing. Fuel costs for the stove really are trivial, especially if I use Kerosene from the heating oil tank! Half decent dehydrated food does cost a few pounds a shot, but not really that much more than 'normal' food. But I'm just as happy nibbling oatcakes and cheese.
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Eating out is a rare treat when im hiking and camping, on my last trip I ate out twice in 8 days of walking. I do however dehydrate my own meals and that saves a small fortune over buying the prepackaged ones also I know I like what I make as its my cooking! My dehydrator was about £30 as well so its all ready paid for it self just in meals, you can also do dried fruit and jerky in it for snacks.
Just doing that would save money to stay on campsites all the time!
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My dehydrator was about £30 !
Which one did you get dank86?
Can you dehydrate things like a curry? We would love to be able to eat a homemade madras or korma when we are out.
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I got one years ago, I found it good for veg and fruit but never had any luck with meat. It always ended up as a discussing brown mess that would never re-hydrate. I hardly ever use it these days as it's just simpler to go and buy what I want.
I got it from Lakeland Plastics.
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Which one did you get dank86?
Can you dehydrate things like a curry? We would love to be able to eat a homemade madras or korma when we are out.
O0
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Which one did you get dank86?
Can you dehydrate things like a curry? We would love to be able to eat a homemade madras or korma when we are out.
I got a VonShef one from Ebay, and yes itll do curry if you use parchment/baking paper on each tray. I did a pulled lamb in recurrent and juniper sauce with veggies that was amazingly lush. I could hear the stomachs of other campers grumbling when i was cooking it on site ;D
http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/710-53481-19255-0/1?icep_ff3=2&pub=5575459367&toolid=10001&campid=5338546930&customid=&icep_item=302566394526&ipn=psmain&icep_vectorid=229508&kwid=902099&mtid=824&kw=lg
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Thanks dank89 O0
I might get one :)
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Thanks dank89 O0
I might get one :)
Be warned though, its addictive!
Dried fruits, jerky, fruit leathers, meals, dry your own fresh herbs etc you can always find an excuse to have it running. Got some bread thatll need to be binned soon dehydrate it and make breadcrumbs for cooking! ;D
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Which one did you get dank86?
Can you dehydrate things like a curry? We would love to be able to eat a homemade madras or korma when we are out.
Just as a follow up to this - dehydrating things is easy once you get into a 'routine', but be prepared to spend a few days doing it when it comes to heavy food like curries. It seems ideal for making things like dehydrated banana or fruits in general/features for adding to meals, but dehydrating full proper meals takes 15-30 hours of non-stop dehydrating and some of the dehydrating trays on the cheaper models are, shall we say, not destined to be long lasting.
By far the worst food to dehydrate is anything with a significant amount of fat in it - simple put it goes rather weird during the dehydration process, so if you're cooking curries specifically don't use ghee, use the leanest meat you can get. Vegetarian curries seem to fare a lot better in that respect, you can then bring a bag of cooked meats specifically to add with it which you cooked the day before your trip - for example.
If I was doing the whole dehydration route again I'd either find someone with a 'proper' dehydrator to borrow or buy one with a bit of longevity in mind, and commit to putting a few long distance trips in the diary to make that saving more immediate and substantial. For example the Excalibur Dehydrators are known as one of the best out there for speed/build quality and range from £140-£240 - if I was less inclined to buy one outright then you could get a few mates to pitch in £50-70 each and share it when we want to do a batch of dehydrating it actually becomes quite cheap, dehydrates faster, trays last longer and helps everyone have more access to longer trips outdoors. Especially since you only ever dehydrate things in bulk batches anyway, throw them in zip bags in the freezer. It pays for itself for the first long distance trip you do, effectively.
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I've had the one I linked to running for 3 days doing different things and all the trays are fine, it is a proper dehydrator just not an expensive one that does the same thing.
Yes fatty items don't dehydrate well and can go off quicker than others, but I wasn't going to get in to all the issues you could have. I'd imagine anyone wanting to do it would start their own thread or google.
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By far the worst food to dehydrate is anything with a significant amount of fat in it - simple put it goes rather weird during the dehydration process, so if you're cooking curries specifically don't use ghee, use the leanest meat you can get. Vegetarian curries seem to fare a lot better in that respect, you can then bring a bag of cooked meats specifically to add with it which you cooked the day before your trip - for example.
Thanks forgotmyoldpassword O0
:) I am vegan and I only use a small amount of olive oil or rapeseed oil when I cook, I hate oily food. I normally use chickpeas or butterbeans in the curries I make. Would they dehydrate ok or would it be best to add them?
I'd imagine anyone wanting to do it would start their own thread or google.
I will have a google before I buy one, thanks Dank86 O0
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April the beans and chickpeas do dehydrate nicely :) I've got some going ATM I love butter beans, having them for dinner 😁
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That is good news dank86 :)
Have you tried dehydrating red wine? ;) ;D
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😂😂 nope but I think I know a way I could!
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😂😂 nope but I think I know a way I could!
No that is filtering it - it leaves you dehydrated.
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Dehydrated water saves carrying a lot of weight.
Just 2 cylinders - one with hydrogen, one with oxygen.
Put the nozzle of the hydrogen into a poly-bag for 4 seconds, then a quick squirt (2 seconds) of oxygen.
Close the bag and shake well.
Lo & behold, a bag full of H2O
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No that is filtering it - it leaves you dehydrated.
;D ;D true but i think I've formulated a plan to try and see if it works ..
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Dehydrated water saves carrying a lot of weight.
Just 2 cylinders - one with hydrogen, one with oxygen.
Put the nozzle of the hydrogen into a poly-bag for 4 seconds, then a quick squirt (2 seconds) of oxygen.
Close the bag and shake well.
Lo & behold, a bag full of H2O
I can save you some work and weight here. Oxygen is present in air so you can save that weight by using feral oxygen. If you put a match to the bag it will shake itself and the condensation (H32O16ish) can be recovered from what is left of the bag. Eyebrows grow back quite quickly.
Just had a thought. If you put the food in the bag you can cook it at and serve everybody at the same time.
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Personally I'd take all your curry ingredients dried and cook it in a pan it rehydrates as it cooks. I dry loads of vegetables and make a tomato and garlic leather from sauce then add the water with spices pulses ect when I cook. I'm usually hostel and self cater with my own homegrown dried vegetables.
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The only timew my camping trips gets costly is when I have to abandon the tent and get b&b. As I don't usually stop for long overnight and camp wild, I don't drink that much if at all, until I'm finished.Probably costs me a tenth of what it costs those that use a baggage serviceand stay in b&b's the whole way.
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Nothing is free,so do we subtract normal living costs?
Camp in your garden,youve still paid for it,buy the "best" gear,use it a dozen times then say youve had a free break...nah..
Cost is irrelevant,enjoyment is surely all that matters.
Wildcampers pay no fees but pay more for the lighter weight kit they carry.
Me..I,m a tight git,i throw a few tins & pot noodles in the car & off i go,£5-10 a night,dont need pub grub,dont need wi-fi,i go to get away for a day or two.
And the cost to me is still irrelevant,the enjoyment however, is priceless ;)
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Price isn’t a guarantee of enjoyment in many areas. However, I have found that going cheap can sometimes be the more expensive option. Whisky, coffee, ice cream, sausages, bacon are but a few things where buying the cheapest is often a waste of money. Buying cheap with some items of hiking gear can also work out to be costly, although I won’t pay a lot more just because something is a few grams lighter.
I am with GWM in that I place enjoyment over price. A hiking trip may be more expensive with pub meals and a few pints, but if that is what you enjoy and you can afford it, go for it.
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All relative I suppose and what's enjoyable for some isn't for others. I tend not to camp anymore, preferring b&b's at my age, done enough 'camping' over the years though, mainly with the Army, but wouldn't dream of using a baggage service on my LDWs. As I get older and less capable though if paying someone to carry my pack meant I could continue with LDWs then I'd feel it would be worth it O0
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I do use campsites and wild camp where there is little option. I enjoy eating in pubs when on a big multi week walk - it is a welcome change from dehydrated food which, no matter how good, is no substitute for fresh food. I try and BnB once a week on a big trip but this is harder with a dog these days. I also think I have a duty to contribute to the local economy of the places I enjoy, if I did not they might not be as they are.
I know a lot of people get enjoyment out of driving to a place after having bought their fuel in the cheap local supermarket, taking all their supplies, wild camping and then driving home having had a good time and spent very little (although taking in the cost of running a car and it is not so cheap) and contributing nothing to the local economy (except their car's pollution) - as if they are bucking the system.
I get a sense of purpose from getting to my start point on public transport, mixing with locals in shops and pubs en route where they exist and experiencing not only the countryside but also the local culture and returning on local transport.
Even when I go on holiday in a cottage with the missus we always try to find good local suppliers of food.
I remember talking to a bloke from Llanberis (a miserable git but he had a point) who called all those who come to walk up Snowdon parasites, he said they come in their hundreds of thousands each year in their busses and cars, go up the mountain and most go home contributing nothing to the local economy. I am not saying I agree but he has a point.
Pubs, public transport, hotels, shops, use it or lose it.
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I suppose that when hiking I do contribute to the local economy a little bit. I use campsites, pubs and coffee shops and every few days I buy a few choccy bars and nuts, however, I never buy anything else unless it's forced on me, (e.g. when a tent pole snapped and I had to buy a couple of small items to repair it) extra items just adds to my carry weight. The reality is we all live in a capitalist economy and the Llanberis man can moan as much as he wants but he cannot change anything in particular unless he and the people that he supports actually do something about it as capitalists and 'inform' the 'parasites' of the error of their ways.
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Is your urge to contribute to the local economy evidence that you are a closet capitalist supporting local businesses or is this a marxist urge to redistribute the wealth?
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Is your urge to contribute to the local economy evidence that you are a closet capitalist supporting local businesses or is this a marxist urge to redistribute the wealth?
Damned if you do and damned if you don't ?
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I know I'm a capitalist, that I can't deny, but I'm also a great fan of the historian Karl Marx at the same time.
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Is your urge to contribute to the local economy evidence that you are a closet capitalist supporting local businesses or is this a marxist urge to redistribute the wealth?
It is a nostalgic and selfish desire to see pubs, shops and local facilities survive in our countryside. :)
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A bit off topic but to me a classic Marx example of capitalism in action. How to create new 'industries' and to make money. Easy make tattooists pass an exam to practise their trade. To get qualified or you can't practice, benefits all round, the tattooists, the qualification designers, the property for the whole educational and training exercise, equipment, desks, PCs, chairs, advertising, printing, catering, the list just goes on and on, brilliant!
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jun/14/call-for-tattooists-and-body-piercers-to-qualify-in-infection-control
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It is a nostalgic and selfish desire to see pubs, shops and local facilities survive in our countryside. :)
Is it selfish? These local facilities are usually the cornerstones of the local community, and we as users of the alternative access network are an important part of that economy. Our contribution may well be, as yet unmeasured, so not fully understood.
It may seem selfish from the standpoint of the property owner, who wants to develop a prime site for a lucrative housing project. But these often rip out the heart of a rural community. A reality that was told to me by a farmer I was talking to in a field above Llangunllo, some years ago, the local pub, the Greyhound, had closed on the death of a very old landlord/owner. A prime site for development but the council held out against a change of use application so that community buy out reopened the pub 5 years later.
It is these historic venues that put character into our countryside. Link the local community to the visitor and provide a part of the conduit for the transference of wealth, that is less than fully understood.
Marion Shoard points out in her books that it is the hospitality trade by being a major employer draws more countryside income than traditional rural pursuits. Camping comes under the heading of hospitality.
Since few landowners now own the pubs that were the hinge point of the the old rural community and the venue they used to collect rents from their tenants, they cannot relate to the income that come to the rural economy by visitors such as us.
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It is a nostalgic and selfish desire to see pubs, shops and local facilities survive in our countryside. :)
Call me selfish then. My village is down to a pub (which is for sale) and 2 shops. When the shops go, it will be a 24 mile round trip on Devon lanes to the nearest one. If the pub goes, it will a drive to any other watering hole.
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You all seen to have misunderstood. I was referring to myself in an ironic way I like living in my idealised past. Keep your wigs on O0
I live in the country and that is why I value and support these things hence the selfishness and why I like to support such facilities in other places. I know how important they are.
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I was referring to myself in an ironic way I like living in my idealised past. Keep your wigs on O0
I thought, having read many of your post over the years M&D that a touch of irony was the pepper and salt on your post. I have to thank you for this remark, it short circuited some memories and brought a realization to me that backs up some suspicions I have had. Ever since first reading the landowner policies and arguments about our footpaths, I have realised that they are badly and dangerously flawed. The part the local hostelry played in the history our countryside and pedestrian travel and how landowners lived off rents has been largely forgotten, since the rise and fall of the brewing industries 8 major breweries and the tied pub. Many country pubs were also small farms, but large land owners were only too keen to capitalize on them post war. They now forget that they were the focal point of cross country routes
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You all seen to have misunderstood. I was referring to myself in an ironic way I like living in my idealised past. Keep your wigs on O0
I live in the country and that is why I value and support these things hence the selfishness and why I like to support such facilities in other places. I know how important they are.
O0 O0 O0
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You all seen to have misunderstood. I was referring to myself in an ironic way I like living in my idealised past. Keep your wigs on O0
I live in the country and that is why I value and support these things hence the selfishness and why I like to support such facilities in other places. I know how important they are.
Glad you clarified - wig now firmly secured O0
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I love the attitude of HW Tilman and Eric Shipton - they would plan a Himalayan expedition on the back of an envelope, and subsist on basic foodstuffs such as atta, rice and sugar, supplemented by pemmican and whatever else they could obtain locally.
If anyone has not read their mountain travel books, I cannot recommend them highly enough.
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As I have said previously, I'm a big fan of oatcakes - very cheap, packed with calories (450kcal/100g), and ideal for conveying large quantities of delicacies such as squirty cheese or pate to the mouth.
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I love the attitude of HW Tilman and Eric Shipton - they would plan a Himalayan expedition on the back of an envelope, and subsist on basic foodstuffs such as atta, rice and sugar, supplemented by pemmican and whatever else they could obtain locally.
If anyone has not read their mountain travel books, I cannot recommend them highly enough.
Is pemmican still available? It sounds revolting.
It should also be pointed out that Tilman in particular was rich enough never needing to work. I believe Shipton also had private money but he did work. Must have been interesting lives.
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Have you read their books, Owen?
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..and pemmican can be had. Tempted to give it a try, although hardly cheap!
http://cowleysfinefoods.co.uk/meat/jerky/beef-pemmican.html (http://cowleysfinefoods.co.uk/meat/jerky/beef-pemmican.html)
Plenty of recipes out there, but somehow I don't fancy it.
Having said that, some of the nut based vegetarian pemmican recipes look quite good.
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Have you read their books, Owen?
Yes I have them all, including a couple of first editions, Ice with everything and That untravelled world.
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..and pemmican can be had. Tempted to give it a try, although hardly cheap!
http://cowleysfinefoods.co.uk/meat/jerky/beef-pemmican.html (http://cowleysfinefoods.co.uk/meat/jerky/beef-pemmican.html)
Plenty of recipes out there, but somehow I don't fancy it.
Having said that, some of the nut based vegetarian pemmican recipes look quite good.
Traditionally ground caribou and butter, rolled into a ball and left out to freeze.
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A pretty decent recipe here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GoyoO4G5Y8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GoyoO4G5Y8)
Ranulph Fiennes also had a recipe for cold weather conditions,soup laced with 55% animal fat.