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Main Boards => Gear => Topic started by: Little Foot on 09:14:50, 31/01/20

Title: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 09:14:50, 31/01/20
Hi all. I went to try on backpacks the other day in Blacks.


They only had a small range. First one I tried was a Berghaus Trailhead 60L. This one touched the back of my head so felt as if I'd be walking head bowed all the time (a few in Go Outdoors that I tried did this too). Could I make adjustments to stop this? It also felt difficult to get on. I have a small problem with my shoulder and it wasn't easy to get through the strap, but perhaps this could be made easier with adjustments.


I then tried the Technical's Helvellyn (https://www.amazon.co.uk/TECHNICALS-Purple-Helvellyn-Short-Rucksack/dp/B07DHPS6V5/ref=asc_df_B07DHPS6V5/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=332105967801&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=14203775915455319746&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9046254&hvtargid=aud-860528267405:pla-698933599563&psc=1) 55L which I bought online. Paid £32 which I realise is dirt cheap. This wasn't easy to put on with the shoulder prob but it didn't touch my head so felt a touch more comfortable compared to the Berghaus.


Now, I tried on an Osprey and this went on a dream, the shoulder straps were flexible enough for me to move my shoulders into position easily and it felt really comfortable on my back. There was a problem though, in that the webbing on the hip belt didn't go round my big, tubby body, so I couldn't fasten it.  :-[


Watching a youtube vid last night, a guy went on a LDW and complained that his Osprey bag had broken so he had to use an old cheap backpack (Blacks brand) and that it wasn't fit for purpose, so now I'm wondering if I have made a mistake buying the Technical one I have (it hasn't been delivered yet).


So, after that essay, I have a few questions. I was in a rush so didn't have chance to have a long talk with the assistant at Blacks.


1. Could I have adjusted the Berghaus to not touch the back of my head? Did the torso adjustment need moving perhaps as I noticed it had torso settings or are some packs just like that?


2. Will the Technical Helvellyn pack be fit for purpose? I noticed reviews of their packs seem ok, but most of those could be based on first impressions.


3. This is the question I'd like answering most. Could I change the Osprey webbing on the hip belt for a longer size? Can Osprey do that, or would it be possible even for myself to do it DIY?


Thanks for looking. Would really like the Osprey backpack but of course, I'd rather not spend over £100 on a bag that won't clip. Hopefully, if I do more walking and lose the lbs I'll have my pick of bags lol
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Slowcoach on 09:21:37, 31/01/20
I believe Osprey are very helpful and have heard of people getting free replacement straps so definitely worth contacting them.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 09:35:07, 31/01/20
Sorry, realise I should have mentioned that I have contacted Osprey and the reply I received pointed me in the direction of their spare parts online form, but this requires me to input details and pictures of a pack I have purchased. I'm unsure of the actual Osprey backpack I want, I just tried the one that had around the amount of litres I needed and was nearest to the ground on the rack as I am short lol.


I have emailed them again asking for a yay or nay but no response yet. I have also emailed Gregory with a similar question and they have forwarded the question to Samsonite who make their backs, but it's been a week since I asked and not had an answer.


I think I could buy webbing on eBay/amazon and try construct something myself, but may make a pigs ear out it.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: ninthace on 09:49:02, 31/01/20
Most backpacks are sufficiently adjustable so that they will fit without banging your head. Reputable shops should be able to fit a backpack to you rather than leaving you to struggle. Also an empty pack will sit higher than a loaded pack and will hang differently.  Some packs also come in sizes as well as volumes depending on whether you have a long or short back.  The back pad in many packs, such as Osprey, can also be adjusted for height.  I am surprised you cannot fasten the Osprey waistband.  I have a fairly generous waistline and have no problems in that regard.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: sussamb on 09:59:11, 31/01/20
Watching a youtube vid last night, a guy went on a LDW and complained that his Osprey bag had broken so he had to use an old cheap backpack (Blacks brand) and that it wasn't fit for purpose, so now I'm wondering if I have made a mistake buying the Technical one I have (it hasn't been delivered yet).

Not sure about the Technical one but just so you know, Osprey and Lowe Alpine both guarantee their sacs for life, I had the chest strap on my Lowe Alpine break and was sent a brand new rucsac.  They are also far less likely to fail than a cheap one.  As you've ordered on line you can return it anyway if it doesn't suit you, so I'd wait until you can try it before you worry about it not fitting etc
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: harland on 10:13:38, 31/01/20
As has been said above "Reputable shops should be able to fit a backpack to you rather than leaving you to struggle."  Whilst not being helpful to you but for other people thinking of buying one then my experience with Cotswolds in Harrogate many years ago is the service that should be given.  I went into the shop having researched it on-line knowing what I wanted!  The assistant got the rucksack out, put some weights into it, and then tried to fit it to my 6'4" body.  He said that it didn't fit me and he would get me another and try that (I thought that it would just be a more expensive one).  He adjusted all the straps and the back adjustment and tried that with weights in the rucksack and it fitted brilliantly to the point that I hardly knew I had it on my back - and it was cheaper than the one I thought I wanted. In addition I was going to walk the Pennine Way (my first LDP) and he got me to come back when I had everything in and he undid everything again and refitted it - I still use it years later.  The staff were and still are all walkers, climbers, cyclists etc so they do know a fair amount about your needs and at the time, but I don't know if it is still the same, but they were not on commission.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 10:15:24, 31/01/20

Most backpacks are sufficiently adjustable so that they will fit without banging your head. Reputable shops should be able to fit a backpack to you rather than leaving you to struggle. Also an empty pack will sit higher than a loaded pack and will hang differently.  Some packs also come in sizes as well as volumes depending on whether you have a long or short back.  The back pad in many packs, such as Osprey, can also be adjusted for height.  I am surprised you cannot fasten the Osprey waistband.  I have a fairly generous waistline and have no problems in that regard.


The packs I tried on were all filled with something, unsure what, but I got a proper feel for how it would sit on my body, but I didn't mess with any adjustments. I'm going in to collect my order so will look in more detail at the Berghaus one. I've seen that Osprey do different sizes for the actual hip belt (rather than just the webbing) so I'd like to think you got a larger one than I tried on, either that or it's my womanly hips. No need to reply to that!  ;D


I think I'm going to look online at Osprey's and choose the one I'm most likely to get, then fill in the form asking about the webbing before I purchase.

Not sure about the Technical one but just so you know, Osprey and Lowe Alpine both guarantee their sacs for life, I had the chest strap on my Lowe Alpine break and was sent a brand new rucsac.  They are also far less likely to fail than a cheap one.  As you've ordered on line you can return it anyway if it doesn't suit you, so I'd wait until you can try it before you worry about it not fitting etc


That's one of the reasons I would like one. The guy who mentioned about the Blacks one not being fit for purpose I think was talking more about the fit of it, and it not being comfortable. If this pack lasts a couple of years before signs of wear and tear start making me look for another, I wouldn't mind for £32, but I don't want it to be really uncomfortable after a few miles, that is my main worry. I will try it on properly once it arrives. It's a click and collect so I will time it so I can spend longer in store and ask advice.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: gunwharfman on 10:16:39, 31/01/20
I have an Osprey Exos 48 and to date have never had a problem with it. In my case, it's by far the best carry setup I know so can't fault that either. I have a Lightwave rucksack, always gave me sore shoulders and the chest strap came off as well. My first rucksack was a Golight Jam, very comfortable but I was never very keen on the roll-top system they used. I much prefer a lid. The Jam is made of Dyneema, excellent and hard-wearing material, always looks new(ish), unlike my Osprey which always looks a bit old, battered and lived in.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 10:22:56, 31/01/20
As has been said above "Reputable shops should be able to fit a backpack to you rather than leaving you to struggle."  Whilst not being helpful to you but for other people thinking of buying one then my experience with Cotswolds in Harrogate many years ago is the service that should be given.  I went into the shop having researched it on-line knowing what I wanted!  The assistant got the rucksack out, put some weights into it, and then tried to fit it to my 6'4" body.  He said that it didn't fit me and he would get me another and try that (I thought that it would just be a more expensive one).  He adjusted all the straps and the back adjustment and tried that with weights in the rucksack and it fitted brilliantly to the point that I hardly knew I had it on my back - and it was cheaper than the one I thought I wanted. In addition I was going to walk the Pennine Way (my first LDP) and he got me to come back when I had everything in and he undid everything again and refitted it - I still use it years later.  The staff were and still are all walkers, climbers, cyclists etc so they do know a fair amount about your needs and at the time, but I don't know if it is still the same, but they were not on commission.


That is excellent service Harland. We have 3 main outdoor stores here. Blacks, Trespass and Go Outdoors. In defence of Blacks, the area I was in was hidden from the staff, so they couldn't see what I was doing, and as I was rushing, just didn't have the chance to go into it with more detail. When I went to Go Outdoors, my dad was with me, raising his eyes at the prices of everything I looked at and suggesting cheap, crappy alternatives of something he knows nothing about. He's like it even in the supermarket, subtly trying to indicate I can get different mushrooms for 15p less. Winds me up as I don't even live with him!
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 10:28:10, 31/01/20
I have an Osprey Exos 48 and to date have never had a problem with it. In my case, it's by far the best carry setup I know so can't fault that either. I have a Lightwave rucksack, always gave me sore shoulders and the chest strap came off as well. My first rucksack was a Golight Jam, very comfortable but I was never very keen on the roll-top system they used. I much prefer a lid. The Jam is made of Dyneema, excellent and hard-wearing material, always looks new(ish), unlike my Osprey which always looks a bit old, battered and lived in.


It might have been an Exos 48 I tried on. It just felt perfect to put on and when sitting on my back too. Perhaps it was because it was a bit smaller than the others though. I think I need to take my time with this, and not rush into things.


The roll top systems seem popular now, but don't think I'd get on with that. I could see it being annoying.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: kinkyboots on 10:52:18, 31/01/20
A couple of YouTube videos which may help

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zy4gs3PHlws (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zy4gs3PHlws)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Et4t4d-26Y (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Et4t4d-26Y)

Getting properly measured is your starting point. Once you know what size you need you can do your research online and start narrowing the range and find the best prices.

From personal experience I know that Osprey can provide hipbelt extension straps free of charge for some packs but for some other packs the whole hipbelt is made in different sizes  and removable so can be exchanged.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Pitboot on 10:55:11, 31/01/20
I agree with kinkyboots. My Osprey had hip belt straps that were too short, they were exchanged in the shop who were aware of the issue and kept spares.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 11:08:17, 31/01/20
Thanks for info all. I'll look at those vids now. I think I'll take a stroll to Blacks with my dog, and ask them about longer straps then (can't see that being embarrassing  :-\ ), hopefully they will have suggestions, but I have a feeling they won't be able to help, not sure why I feel like that.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Patrick1 on 13:55:31, 31/01/20
I'm another Exos48 user, and reckon its the most comfortable rucksack I've had, while being almost as light as some of the rather hardcore minimalist designs of rucksack. There's a specific women's version called the Eja. You would clearly need to sort the hipbelt issue so that it fitted. Just a thought - be aware this rucksack comes in different sizes to suit different torso lengths. I don't know if this has any influence on the hip belt length, but it might be worth investigating.


How a rucksack is adjusted can cause it to touch the back of your head. If it is doing so, then try loosening the waist belt - make sure its sitting on your hips not your stomach. Then look at the shoulder straps - the adjusters under your arms are for raising the pack on your back, the ones over the top of your shoulders are for pulling the pack in against your back. Loosen both, then tighten them until you're just taking a bit of weight on your shoulders and the pack is touching your back but not tight. The small straps on the top of your shoulders pulling the pack against your back should be horizontal or just sloping slightly up towards the rucksack. If they're sloping steeply up the back length is probably too short for you, and you either need to adjust it, if that is possible, or try a different size.



Of the rather poor selection of outdoor shops you have near you I'd reckon Blacks is your best bet. Go Outdoors can be good value, but takes a supermarket approach to selling as and such is only worth going to if you are clear yourself what you want and have found they happen to have a good price for it. Trespass, as far as I remember, only really sell their own brand stuff, which is cheap and cheerful.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 14:25:51, 31/01/20
Thanks for the reply Patrick. I did know the rucksacks came in different torso lengths (I'm XS-S) and know the hip belts come in different lengths too but I guess if you buy a size S it will automatically come with a small hip belt. I now know watching one of the vids kinkyboots linked to, where I can find the sizing, so that will help.

I received this reply after querying the first reply from Osprey, and it is a little more helpful, but slightly confusing for me.

Quote
The extension would be made suitable/ compatible with the pack in question, we wouldn’t supply anything that would not fit the pack you need an extension for.

The hipbelt comes in one size, this is not interchangeable, however, this is why we can offer extension hipbelt webbing if required. As I mentioned, you would need to contact our Guarantee and Spares Team to request this part. You would need to purchase the pack before asking for the extension webbing ideally (for measurments), however, there is always a returns policy (wherever you purchase) if the pack is unsuitable.

I'm only confused as I thought on some of the models, the actual hip belt could be changed for a more suitable size. I'm going to go into Blacks later and having a proper look, and I will speak to the assistant about fitting and changing the webbing. Although it is a small store, they do seem more customer focused. Go Outdoors had no staff on the shop floor and I agree with you about Trespass. Their gear isn't top notch.

We do have a Winfields, which didn't have Osprey bags on display, but they did the Berghaus that I tried on at Blacks and that didn't go as close to my head, so I expect it was set up differently.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Bigfoot_Mike on 17:02:05, 31/01/20
I am pretty sure that you can get extension straps for Osprey rucksacks that clip into the existing connectors. I almost (but not quite) needed some for my rucksack.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 18:26:04, 31/01/20
I went to Blacks and had a look at the Osprey bag I had tried previously and it was a 68L Kestrel in s/m so bigger Litre pack than I thought. I spoke with a staff member but she said changing the straps in conjunction with Osprey is not a service they provide, but she showed me some webbing so in theory I could try make my own if there was no other alternative. I think I might try my luck and order one then deal with Osprey.


Just having an extension sounds good Bigfoot_Mike. Certainly a lot easier than undoing old then reattaching new webbing.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: gunwharfman on 18:36:20, 31/01/20
Have you considered an additional chest pack as well, I used one for some time until I learned how to get my gear down to a minimum.

Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 18:39:37, 31/01/20
No, I don't know about chest packs. Is it just a normal pack situated on the chest then?
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: kinkyboots on 18:57:53, 31/01/20
I'm only confused as I thought on some of the models, the actual hip belt could be changed for a more suitable size.

I'm pretty sure that it's only the top of the range models which have the replaceable full hip belts. All the other models have webbing straps which are attached to the wings of the hipbelt and hip belt extensions can be obtained via Osprey if necessary. They are basically a pair of longer replacement straps with the central buckle on (they just thread on in place off the existing straps) - you just need to let them know which model and how long you need the webbing strap to be via their online form.   

NB The Kestrel 68 is the men's model the Kyte 66 is the equivalent women's model.
https://www.blacks.co.uk/equipment/200929-osprey-kestrel-68l-rucksack-grey.html (https://www.blacks.co.uk/equipment/200929-osprey-kestrel-68l-rucksack-grey.html)
https://www.blacks.co.uk/equipment/119311-osprey-women-s-kyte-66l-rucksack-grey.html (https://www.blacks.co.uk/equipment/119311-osprey-women-s-kyte-66l-rucksack-grey.html)

My advice would be to take your time makng the decision on which model you want and shop around online for the best available price.



Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: gunwharfman on 19:05:17, 31/01/20
The chest pack I had was sold by OEM and was 4L in capacity. It just fitted to my shoulder straps and worked well. I thought the main drawback was that it wasn't a waterproofed pack. I tended to use it as my 'kitchen,' I think others would have used it for their cameras etc.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 19:24:58, 31/01/20
Kinkyboots - The Kestrel 66l is a little bit too big, but felt both easy to get on and comfortable to wear. I have taken a chance as I have managed to get the last Osprey Kestrel 58L for £60 from Blacks!

It must have been the last as it has now vanished from the site. Great deal, as it had money off, then I managed to get another 20% off with their promo. Hope they don't realise lol. If it is unsuitable it should be easy to return. It seems you can get the extra 20% off some branded items (on items that have not already been discounted by the 20%), despite it saying it excludes other offers.

Gunwharfman - a chest pack seems a good idea, although might be slightly easier for flat chested guys to wear.  ;D
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: kinkyboots on 19:50:41, 31/01/20
That's a bargain price at around half the price of the Kestrel 66 and as long as it has the features you need, fits you properly and is comfortable that's all that matters.

The key now is to try to reduce the weight you carry in it by resisting the temptation to fill it with loads of stuff you won't/don't use but still have to carry.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 19:59:24, 31/01/20
That's a bargain price at around half the price of the Kestrel 66 and as long as it has the features you need, fits you properly and is comfortable that's all that matters.

The key now is to try to reduce the weight you carry in it by resisting the temptation to fill it with loads of stuff you won't/don't use but still have to carry.


Certainly is a bargain. It's back on the site now, but without the original price showing. Funny that it said 'one left' when in the process of buying. Here it is. (https://www.blacks.co.uk/equipment/230457-osprey-kestrel-58-backpack-black.html) When you go to the checkout it reduces to less than the £60.

I have a 30L Berghaus that I have used for a few days without camping so think this one will be the right size when you consider the extra kit I will have.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Butchersboy on 09:42:14, 01/02/20
I can vouch for the Exos 48.
Very light, comfortable and I suspect it holds way more than 48L.


I got Go Outdoors to price match promise somewhere online so got it even cheaper 8)


I couldn't imaging wearing anything bigger on a long-distance walk.


The bigger the bag the more stuff you don't need you will pack!
I've since switched to a 33L bag.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: gunwharfman on 11:31:17, 01/02/20
If I wanted or needed to spend out the money on a new rucksack I could easily hike and camp with a smaller one. I think the maximum capacity that I would need is between 42-45L. I'm not going to, of course, for now, my Exos 48L is fine.

When we look at new rucksacks they mostly seem to be from the same group of manufacturers, even the people who test seem to go for this group. There are lots of others, of course, for example, I've been looking at the 50L Naturehike ones, on the screen they look fine, I personally like the look of their black one. I won't buy it because I have no idea if it's any good or not? If I did have to buy a new one I would like to go for the make Nigor, their rucksacks are made from Dymeena which I personally like and rate highly but I won't buy it, their prices are just too high!
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: fernman on 11:42:42, 01/02/20
I can vouch for the Exos 48.
Very light, comfortable and I suspect it holds way more than 48L.
I got Go Outdoors to price match promise somewhere online so got it even cheaper 8)
I couldn't imaging wearing anything bigger on a long-distance walk.
The bigger the bag the more stuff you don't need you will pack!
I've since switched to a 33L bag.

I really don't know how you can say that. My 75L pack (that includes lid and side pockets) only weighs 8.17kg (18 lb) with spring and autumn gear, or a grand total of 10.4kg (23 lb) with a litre of water and four days food, yet my sleeping bag, ground mat, tent, base layers and spare undies, fleece jumper, down jacket and then the above mentioned food, fill it pretty much right up, while waterproofs go on the top and small bits and pieces in the pockets. So how you can say you go on a long distance walk with only a 33L bag or even a 48L one is beyond me, unless you're staying in B&Bs and not carrying camping equipment.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: gunwharfman on 12:06:38, 01/02/20
I use a 48L and always have space to spare. OK, I don't take cooking equipment (I eat out) with me but if I did those items would go in easily. I have used my 48L rucksack on 2, 3, and 4-week hiking trips and have always had more than enough space. I also don't carry a camera, just my smartphone.

One reason for this, of course, is that I have actively tried to make my load lighter and smaller in overall size and so now only take what I need, rather than what I THINK I need. I also have some really good items that roll up very small, like my Thermarest Neoair mattress (to the size of a Coca Cola can) for example and I also try to develop the idea of dual-use for clothing, for example when I sleep I wear a clean and dry base layer and will hike in it the next day, and will use my single skin waterproof coat as a wind jacket as well. Hiking like this with the equipment and clothing that I now use has helped me to make very useful progress for myself. I have also deliberately bought lightweight items, a down sleeping quilt rather than use a (heavier?) down sleeping bag and I use a very lightweight rain skirt rather than use (heavier?) waterproof trousers. I've learned that as I get older, every little step forward helps me a lot!

My way of needing less rucksack space is that I also carry items on the outside of my rucksack, my tent, for example, that just sits on the top of my rucksack horizontally, held by two short lengths of elastic.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 12:21:38, 01/02/20
I think a 58L will be ok for me, as I'll have to carry a large amount of my son's gear, as well as a couple of things so he is not bored in the evening, like mini football, travel games. I've looked at an online review of the Osprey Kestrel and it can be sinched up if it's not full, so it won't be wobbling about all over the place.

I think I'm going to test things and do a long walk then have an overnight stay on the Yorkshire Wolds Way, see how things go, then progress bit by bit.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Bigfoot_Mike on 12:30:11, 01/02/20
A person’s size will dramatically affect the volume and weight required to be carried (and probably the weight that can be carried). If you are 5 feet tall and weigh 7 stones, your spare kit won’t take up much space or weigh much. If you are over 6 feet and weigh considerably more (I  might fit into 1 or more of those categories), then your spare kit will be bigger and heavier and a 2 person tent might appear to be a 1 person tent to you. I have never worried too much about weight of walking kit or my photography gear. I can always reduce the weight being carried by going on a diet. In the end, the best rucksack, waterproof or camera is the one you have to hand when you need it.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: kinkyboots on 13:12:24, 01/02/20
I think a 58L will be ok for me, as I'll have to carry a large amount of my son's gear, as well as a couple of things so he is not bored in the evening, like mini football, travel games.

Why? You have already mentioned that you have the perfect solution?

Give your son the 30L Berghaus rucksack and let him carry his own stuff. I'm sure that he will be more than capable and will be happy to help and be more involved.

Every little helps!  ;D
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 13:38:53, 01/02/20
A person’s size will dramatically affect the volume and weight required to be carried (and probably the weight that can be carried). If you are 5 feet tall and weigh 7 stones, your spare kit won’t take up much space or weigh much. If you are over 6 feet and weigh considerably more (I  might fit into 1 or more of those categories), then your spare kit will be bigger and heavier and a 2 person tent might appear to be a 1 person tent to you. I have never worried too much about weight of walking kit or my photography gear. I can always reduce the weight being carried by going on a diet. In the end, the best rucksack, waterproof or camera is the one you have to hand when you need it.

I can only wish I was 7 stones. That's precisely why I need a bigger bag. It's 20% of a person's weight, the amount they can carry, isn't it? If it is, I can carry a lot!  ;D  Just starting out, I am having to get the basics so can't afford to get the ultra small and light kit all at once. I think I'd rather have a bag slightly too big for me needs, than one too small.

Why? You have already mentioned that you have the perfect solution?

Give your son the 30L Berghaus rucksack and let him carry his own stuff. I'm sure that he will be more than capable and will be happy to help and be more involved

Every little helps!  ;D


Oh he will be carrying his fair share of gear, believe me. He will have his sleeping gear, clothes plus a few extras. I think the max he can carry is around 6kg. I also have a dog who may be joining on short trips so will have her gear to consider too.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: ninthace on 13:53:48, 01/02/20
Make the dog carry its own gear https://www.amazon.co.uk/saddle-bags-dogs/s?k=saddle+bags+for+dogs&page=3 (https://www.amazon.co.uk/saddle-bags-dogs/s?k=saddle+bags+for+dogs&page=3)
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Bigfoot_Mike on 13:56:01, 01/02/20
I can only wish I was 7 stones. That's precisely why I need a bigger bag. It's 20% of a person's weight, the amount they can carry, isn't it? If it is, I can carry a lot!  ;D  Just starting out, I am having to get the basics so can't afford to get the ultra small and light kit all at once. I think I'd rather have a bag slightly too big for me needs, than one too small.
On that basis I could also carry a fair weight. I think carrying capacity will vary with fitness, age, distance to be walked, difficulty of the terrain and the source of the weight. Muscle can carry a greater proportion of its weight. When I was younger I carried 25kg around the Alps for 2 weeks, walking in excess of 20 miles on some days at reasonably high altitudes. That was more than 25% of my body weight at the time, but I was very fit. I don’t think I could do that now, but I could still carry a fair weight. I wouldn’t worry about ultralight. Just start off slowly with distances you can manage and gradually increase as you become fitter. It becomes increasingly more expensive to lose a few grams here and there.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: alan de enfield on 13:56:10, 01/02/20
Make the dog carry its own gear https://www.amazon.co.uk/saddle-bags-dogs/s?k=saddle+bags+for+dogs&page=3 (https://www.amazon.co.uk/saddle-bags-dogs/s?k=saddle+bags+for+dogs&page=3)



(https://i.postimg.cc/PpW2gsKG/Dudley-At-War.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/PpW2gsKG)
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: ninthace on 14:04:19, 01/02/20
  ;D
 I hiked in the Pyrenees with a friend who had a biggish dog (a Patou) that not only carried its own gear but had a bit of spare capacity.  He also taught it to sleep outside his tent to act as a windbreak.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 14:48:11, 01/02/20
Make the dog carry its own gear https://www.amazon.co.uk/saddle-bags-dogs/s?k=saddle+bags+for+dogs&page=3 (https://www.amazon.co.uk/saddle-bags-dogs/s?k=saddle+bags+for+dogs&page=3)


She's the size of a Shih Tzu, and pretty much a lap dog. If anything is getting carried, it'd be her.  ;D
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 14:52:54, 01/02/20
On that basis I could also carry a fair weight. I think carrying capacity will vary with fitness, age, distance to be walked, difficulty of the terrain and the source of the weight. Muscle can carry a greater proportion of its weight. When I was younger I carried 25kg around the Alps for 2 weeks, walking in excess of 20 miles on some days at reasonably high altitudes. That was more than 25% of my body weight at the time, but I was very fit. I don’t think I could do that now, but I could still carry a fair weight. I wouldn’t worry about ultralight. Just start off slowly with distances you can manage and gradually increase as you become fitter. It becomes increasingly more expensive to lose a few grams here and there.


I am used to walking short distances, but you're right in that I don't want to be pushing myself too much or regretting a large back an hour after we start on a longer trek. I think once bits of kit arrive, I can make a better choice of what I should be taking. Looking forward to doing a test run on the YWW soon.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 14:53:25, 01/02/20
  ;D
 I hiked in the Pyrenees with a friend who had a biggish dog (a Patou) that not only carried its own gear but had a bit of spare capacity.  He also taught it to sleep outside his tent to act as a windbreak.


Sounds like the dog would have been perfect for a pillow!
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: gunwharfman on 15:12:27, 01/02/20
I had a run-in with a Patou sheepdog just west of Riez, France last year, frightened the life out of me! I was walking along a flat section of the GR4, saw a flock of sheep ahead but didn't really take much notice. Suddenly the flock parted and this enormous white Patou dog came charging at me, barking, slobbering and looking for blood!!!

I stopped dead in my tracks and started to walk backwards and luckily this 'saved' me! The dog stopped, it kept barking and slobbering though so I walked back a few more paces. The dog then decided to return to the flock, I didn't move for a while, I just waited until the flock drifted away from me and the path and then strolled on. I felt lucky!
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Butchersboy on 15:15:27, 01/02/20
I really don't know how you can say that. My 75L pack (that includes lid and side pockets) only weighs 8.17kg (18 lb) with spring and autumn gear, or a grand total of 10.4kg (23 lb) with a litre of water and four days food, yet my sleeping bag, ground mat, tent, base layers and spare undies, fleece jumper, down jacket and then the above mentioned food, fill it pretty much right up, while waterproofs go on the top and small bits and pieces in the pockets. So how you can say you go on a long distance walk with only a 33L bag or even a 48L one is beyond me, unless you're staying in B&Bs and not carrying camping equipment.


Yes it includes camping equipment, I should clarify the 33L would only be viable in summer months. I'll be using that for the coast to coast this summer.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: ninthace on 16:06:10, 01/02/20
I had a run-in with a Patou sheepdog just west of Riez, France last year, frightened the life out of me! I was walking along a flat section of the GR4, saw a flock of sheep ahead but didn't really take much notice. Suddenly the flock parted and this enormous white Patou dog came charging at me, barking, slobbering and looking for blood!!!

I stopped dead in my tracks and started to walk backwards and luckily this 'saved' me! The dog stopped, it kept barking and slobbering though so I walked back a few more paces. The dog then decided to return to the flock, I didn't move for a while, I just waited until the flock drifted away from me and the path and then strolled on. I felt lucky!
That is exactly what they are trained to do.  If you see a flock in the hills in the Pyrenees it will often be guarded by one or more Patou.  As puppies they are imprinted on the flock and will protect it from predators.  Provided you avoid the flock and behave in a non aggressive manner you are fine so speak softly, avoid eye contact and do not advance into the flock.  I have had up to 4 barking at me but I am still here and unbitten.  By behaving in a non threatening way and staying clear you did the right thing.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: gunwharfman on 17:49:07, 01/02/20
When I was hiking the GR10 across the Pyrenees in 2015 I saw a number of Patou's looking after their sheep but none bothered me because I was too far away from them at the time. I was always very wary though.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: sussamb on 19:13:22, 01/02/20
I really don't know how you can say that. My 75L pack (that includes lid and side pockets) only weighs 8.17kg (18 lb) with spring and autumn gear, or a grand total of 10.4kg (23 lb) with a litre of water and four days food, yet my sleeping bag, ground mat, tent, base layers and spare undies, fleece jumper, down jacket and then the above mentioned food, fill it pretty much right up, while waterproofs go on the top and small bits and pieces in the pockets. So how you can say you go on a long distance walk with only a 33L bag or even a 48L one is beyond me, unless you're staying in B&Bs and not carrying camping equipment.

I'm impressed.  I'll be carrying around 12kgs on my C2C in March, in a 45L sac, to cope with 12 days on the route, but without any camping gear, so how you get down to 8 to 10kgs with camping gear I have no idea, especially using a 75L sac, must be plenty of room to spare  :)
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: gunwharfman on 10:09:16, 02/02/20
When I hiked on La Palma recently my pack Exos 48 plus contents weighed 8kg, I carried my Hunker bivi with me, left my tent behind and that seemed to cut down the weight a fair amount. The pleasure didn't last long however because I then had to stock up with food and water and because there is no drinking water en route (unless it rains) I ended up with 4.5L of it on my back, that was 3L in my water bladder inside the rucksack and a 1.5L bottle strapped across the top of my rucksack.

By the time I'd drunk some of the bottled water I had to listen to the rest of the water moving and bashing itself inside the bottle just behind my head as I walked. It got very annoying after a while!
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: fernman on 11:30:08, 02/02/20
I'm impressed.  I'll be carrying around 12kgs on my C2C in March, in a 45L sac, to cope with 12 days on the route, but without any camping gear, so how you get down to 8 to 10kgs with camping gear I have no idea, especially using a 75L sac, must be plenty of room to spare  :)

This is how I've done it: over the last few years I've been through my gear list (which you can find on my website, and there's also a page headed reducing pack weight) again and again, looking hard at each item one by one, and I kept searching online to see if I could find a lighter alternative, within my budget of course.
It's something retired people have the time to do, but I'd also get my laptop out and do it while my wife was watching a boring programme on the television (which was quite often, lol).
There isn't as much room in my pack as you might think, but while some things are bulky they aren't heavy!
I have now reached the point where I can not make any more gains at all, without spending hundreds of pounds which I don't have on lighter tent, ground mat and sleeping bag.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: sussamb on 11:42:05, 02/02/20
Food for thought, must say I tend to pack quite a few things 'just in case'. For example my main navigation aid is my GPS. My phone is a backup but I also carry a spare phone as a backup to that.  Never had to use it mind, but sods law says if I don't take it I'll need it  ;D
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: alan de enfield on 11:49:51, 02/02/20

I have now reached the point where I can not make any more gains at all, without spending hundreds of pounds which I don't have on lighter tent, ground mat and sleeping bag.

I have actually gone down the reduce weight programme, which has in some cases be at the expense of comfort and usability and I am now going back the other way.

For example my 'mat' has gone from an 'air mattress' (weighing 460 grams) to a down filled 'Exped' air mat (weighing 908 grams) and my tent (complete package) has gone from 1.64 kgs to 2.2kgs

Comfort and space are becoming more important that being a 'gram counter'.
As long as I am comfortable carrying the weight I'll keep going.

My 'full' pack (3 days food, clothes, 2 litres water, water filtering, cooking equipment, 1st Aid kit, etc etc and my 'electronic toys' and 'just in case stuff') weighs 14kgs
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: archaeoroutes on 12:00:08, 02/02/20
Could the problem with the Berghaus pack banging back of head referred to in the OP have simply been that the top* straps were pulled tight for shipping/display?
* The ones many packs have from lid to top of shoulders that allow you to adjust the pack to be upright.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: gunwharfman on 12:47:05, 02/02/20
My back up is my Pebbell alarm, I've never had to use it yet. I considered buying a GPS once but never did.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: watershed on 14:08:59, 02/02/20
from the Photo on your link it looks a very good buy at that price.
The only worry may be the weight. I didn't see any reference to it.
I have an old Blacks rucksack that looks similar. I use it for practice walks now when I just want to get miles in the hill, carrying weight, to prepare me for a multi day camp/hike. Also used for carrying errands home from supermarket.
For the actual trip I use an Osprey EXOS 58L, which saves about 4lb weight. This is the slightly older model that had pockets in the hip belt. one of the complaints that used to be levelled at them was the short hip belts.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: fernman on 16:45:12, 02/02/20
Comfort and space are becoming more important that being a 'gram counter'.
As long as I am comfortable carrying the weight I'll keep going.

There lies the conundrum, as you get older and older you want to carry less and less weight!
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: jimbob on 16:55:22, 02/02/20
There lies the conundrum, as you get older and older you want to carry less and less weight!
O0
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 17:35:47, 02/02/20
from the Photo on your link it looks a very good buy at that price.
The only worry may be the weight. I didn't see any reference to it.
I have an old Blacks rucksack that looks similar. I use it for practice walks now when I just want to get miles in the hill, carrying weight, to prepare me for a multi day camp/hike. Also used for carrying errands home from supermarket.
For the actual trip I use an Osprey EXOS 58L, which saves about 4lb weight. This is the slightly older model that had pockets in the hip belt. one of the complaints that used to be levelled at them was the short hip belts.


I went into Black again, and they had the Technicals one that I linked to down to £28 when it was £40 a few days before (originally £70). I tried on the Berghaus one again, with help from an assistant who adjusted it, and it didn't hit my head.


I'm just waiting on the Osprey Kestrel 58 to arrive now. Can't believe I have got it for £60! Hopefully they won't cancel it lol
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: MudMagnet on 11:11:17, 03/02/20
Kestrel 58 for £60, bargain.  Even if it's not right, put it on e-bay, you'll probably make money on it.

A +1 for the Exos 48 as well.  Love mine, but I also have the montane Grand Tour 70L for hammock camping which is a beast of a pack.  They also do a 50L version which may well be worth a look.
Good luck and enjoy the kit shopping :)  its half the fun for me.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 07:40:49, 04/02/20
Haha you are right there. Am enjoying hunting for kit, although my bank balance isn't. Collect my bag today, so super excited for that!


Edit - collected my Osprey rucksack today. It looks great. I contacted Osprey right away about the hip webbing, and they are sorting out ones straight away. Can't fault their service on that.
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Lee R on 21:53:46, 04/02/20
Haha you are right there. Am enjoying hunting for kit, although my bank balance isn't. Collect my bag today, so super excited for that!


Edit - collected my Osprey rucksack today. It looks great. I contacted Osprey right away about the hip webbing, and they are sorting out ones straight away. Can't fault their service on that.


I think you need to register the pack/details on their website for the lifetime warranty  O0
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: sussamb on 22:11:52, 04/02/20
No idea about Osprey, but not a requirement for Lowe Alpine  O0
Title: Re: Backpack - Mistake?
Post by: Little Foot on 22:52:23, 04/02/20

I think you need to register the pack/details on their website for the lifetime warranty  O0


I contacted them about changing the webbing before I registered the product, so they were going to send out the spare parts before I registered it. I did register soon after they emailed though as figured it can't hurt.