Oops she did it again

[pdstsp]

Right to roam works well in Scotland - and I don't think anyone walks through other peoples gardens or lounges 

[WhitstableDave]

Right to roam works well in Scotland - and I don't think anyone walks through other peoples gardens or lounges 

Is that because in Scotland (as elsewhere) it's not permitted to roam through other people's gardens (curtilage)?

Right to roam has its limitations. 

[Andies]

Just a thought...

If trespass becomes a criminal offence, is it possible that making a forum post (i.e. a social media post) that appears to encourage others to commit trespass might be considered an act of incitement (to commit a criminal offence)? Might it also be possible that a forum owner who does not remove such posts might be open to a charge of conspiracy to incite others to commit a criminal offence?

As I said, it's just a thought - but it might be applicable before long. I don't think that incitement or conspiracy to incite can be applied to civil offences, but I'm pretty sure they can be applied to criminal ones...

An interesting point  but I don't think my previous post, if that was what you are referring to, is actually inciting anyone. I'm just explaining what I do. It's up to everyone to reach their own opinion and act accordingly. Of course if you feel I or anyone herein is breaking the forum rules or worse encouraging people to commit acts contrary to the law then best inform the moderator or others...just a thought
The whole criminalisation of trespass has already been discussed at some length on the forum. The Ramblers response sums it up well for me.

Trespass however you look at it is against the law, and to suggest abusing somebody who tells you to stop is just creating a whole additional issue for no gain at all. 
Doesnt do the image of walkers any good in the countryside does it.

Notwithstanding my views on trespassing in certain circumstances I would always try to avoid confrontation and when it has occurred I have never resorted to abusing someone even when they have me. Their actions say more than I ever could and have led in large part to my views on the subject.

[jimbob]

How did this get to walking through people's gardens?

As walkers we should, in my opinion, be looking for the same walking laws that exist in Scotland.

I have always tended to walk where I want, ROW or not, however I would never knowingly cause any breach of personal privacy, or damage to the property of others.

I have been questioned on occasion but never harassed by anyone, in fact on a couple of occasions I have been told of some sight worth seeing on the man's land, once just last August near Whitby.

When I was still living in North Northumberland it was the gamekeepers who caused trouble and never the landowners. Never with me, I may add, because I was taught from a very young age when not to go into certain areas out of respect to the nesting birds and also so as not to get a load of shot in the jacksy.

As for the gardens I have reread the items and can see no one mentioning deliberately breaching anyone's privacy. I think the general thrust was towards open land and byways.

[WhitstableDave]

An interesting point  but I don't think my previous post, if that was what you are referring to, is actually inciting anyone. I'm just explaining what I do. It's up to everyone to reach their own opinion and act accordingly. Of course if you feel I or anyone herein is breaking the forum rules or worse encouraging people to commit acts contrary to the law then best inform the moderator or others...just a thought
The whole criminalisation of trespass has already been discussed at some length on the forum. The Ramblers response sums it up well for me.Notwithstanding my views on trespassing in certain circumstances I would always try to avoid confrontation and when it has occurred I have never resorted to abusing someone even when they have me. Their actions say more than I ever could and have led in large part to my views on the subject.

No, I wasn't suggesting that your post was inciting anyone. I tried to be very clear that incitement would only become an issue if trespass became illegal and, as far as I know, that hasn't happened (yet). However, I do think it's worth bearing in mind that if trespass does become illegal, then members might wish to be a little more circumspect in their comments. That's all. 

[April]

Im sure all those that agree with such a view would be quite happy for people to roam at will through their private gardens also? 

There are some PROW's that go through people's gardens. Near Gilsland on Hadrians Wall and one at Glencoyne near Ullswater, to mention just two, there are lots of them. Nobody on here would want to intrude on anyone's privacy and we always feel awkward on this part of the paths even though it it is a right of way. Why the Kinder Trespass happened was because people wanted access to open countryside, they didn't want access to people's back gardens and personal space.

[April]

Is nobody going to say "female navigators"? 

Are you saying that female navigators are so much better than their male counterparts they don't need a mention?

[ninthace]

I was pondering the Kinder trespass this afternoon.  Hypothetically speaking, it is possible that had the the landowners and their minions just  ignored the trespass rather than resorting to strong tactics, then the newspaper stories and  prosecutions that followed would not have happened and the event would not have fired up the public imagination in the way that it did.  In which case, would we have ended up the access we now enjoy culminating in the CROW Act?  Perhaps in a perverse way, we have the landowners to thank as much as the trespassers themselves.

[richardh1905]

I am surprised by your attitude here to be honest.


If i went running through your private back garden would you just wave at me smile and let me carry on? 
i thought not.
Terrible advert for our hobby to behavemin such a manner.

I don't think that GWM is running through anyone's back garden.


..although I am with ninthace on this.

[richardh1905]

I was pondering the Kinder trespass this afternoon.  Hypothetically speaking, it is possible that had the the landowners and their minions just  ignored the trespass rather than resorting to strong tactics, then the newspaper stories and  prosecutions that followed would not have happened and the event would not have fired up the public imagination in the way that it did.  In which case, would we have ended up the access we now enjoy culminating in the CROW Act?  Perhaps in a perverse way, we have the landowners to thank as much as the trespassers themselves.

Interesting thought.

[pdstsp]

Is that because in Scotland (as elsewhere) it's not permitted to roam through other people's gardens (curtilage)?

Right to roam has its limitations. 

I think it's probably more to do with respecting the homes of others.

[WhitstableDave]

Right to roam works well in Scotland - and I don't think anyone walks through other peoples gardens or lounges 

I think it's probably more to do with respecting the homes of others.

...as opposed to the right to roam working well in Scotland? 

[Bigfoot_Mike]

In general, Scotland has a different terrain to England and, outside the central belt, a sparse population. Roaming responsibly is potentially more difficult in areas with a higher population density or more intensive farming.

[pleb]

Are you saying that female navigators are so much better than their male counterparts they don't need a mention?

[Bigfoot_Mike]

Are you saying that female navigators are so much better than their male counterparts they don't need a mention?

Not if we are talking about my wife. I don’t think this is a gender thing, just a complete lack of a sense of direction. The only hope she has of understanding any type of map is if the map is lined up in the same direction as the terrain. She is completely lost if the map is not aligned, but perhaps that is quite a common experience. I don’t need this and can readily move from a map to terrain without them being aligned.