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Main Boards => General Walking Discussion => Topic started by: gunwharfman on 10:42:21, 30/03/20

Title: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 10:42:21, 30/03/20
I've been thinking about it, I have material, needles and thread and a fair amount of elasticated cord in my garage.

I'm already using my homemade elasticated-around-the-wrist hand Goretex tubes (cut off sleeves from an old jacket) to open doors, etc, they work very well, never thought for one second I would be using them for this, I only made them to keep my hands dry in the rain.

I've already seen a Deliveroo cyclist in the area that's adapted his cycle hat, thanks to 'Sellotape' he now has a full face mask. No idea how it works, how he breathes and so on but it looked very futuristic!

I also have my wrap-around wind glasses but have not yet decided to adapt and use them yet.

Are you using your hiking and camping knowledge to help you through this difficulty?
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 11:12:58, 30/03/20
On another thread the use of a Buff was discussed.  It would require careful removal though, to prevent the transfer of virus particles to the face or into the air and would have to be thoroughly cleaned between use.
WHO wisdom is that masks for the layman are best avoided unless you actually have the disease, when they will act as a droplet trap.  They have to fitted correctly to stand any chance of working and they have to be of the right sort of material and pattern to work at all.  If they are not fitted correctly you end up fiddling with them which encourages facial contact and of course they concentrate viral particles close to your face which could be a hazard during removal and disposal.  In fact, if they leak they would concentrate particles on your face that may otherwise be inhaled and exhaled.
Clearly they have a role in areas where there is a high viral burden in the atmosphere and they are of the right type, being worn by a trained user.  For the non medical wearer, they are probably more of  a psychological comfort than an effective barrier.


The prevalent wearing of masks in the orient is actually more of a cultural thing.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: mountaingal on 11:25:21, 30/03/20
I am going to make one. It's very frustrating and scary to see people (incl me) wandering around without face masks, not knowing who is carrying the virus without symptoms. I feel exposed. A week ago, I'd just escaped from Cyprus which was about to shut down, and come back to UK. Although they only found infections lately, they quickly adapted the advice of wearing masks. On the last day, the bus driver complained to me for not wearing a mask and almost refused to put me on. In the end, he told me to sit at the back. I had to go to the airport to come home. People in the Far Eastern countries are wearing masks. They have been more successful in containing. Face mask should be worn in the public as well as keeping 2 meters away from each other. There are occasions when it's not possible to keep 2 meters away. We have to do everything we can to stop spreading. It was a bad advice for the government to say 'Face mask does not stop you getting infected'. It may not help yourself but it can stop spreading to the others. When people carrying virus without symptoms talk, they are spluttering the droplets.   Even health professionals can't get ones, so the government is staying away from the subject :-X .
People want to believe what they want to believe when there are conflicting advices. But I want to do as much as I can.
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/03/would-everyone-wearing-face-masks-help-us-slow-pandemic# (https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/03/would-everyone-wearing-face-masks-help-us-slow-pandemic#)
We always wore washable reusable face masks when we caught cold, not to spread the virus to the others when I was a child in Japan. They are made of gauze. Now shops are closed. I thought about checking the surgical gauze in boots. My nearest one only have a hatch open for people to queue. So I decided not to hang around.
My sister says surgical gauze is not dense enough. I may have to cut my gauze tea towel.... ::)
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 11:33:42, 30/03/20
I accept all that but having a face mask, whether or not it works, helps personal morale I think. In my communication over Skype and the like one person I know is trying to preserve the life of his mask by folding a tissue into it, he then takes the tissue out and disposes of it. I like the orient idea of wearing face masks, coughing into one's sleeve, yuk! Having the experience of watching people down the pub over a number of years I can't believe that basic Brit habits of coughing into the air, burping into the air and yawning into the air have changed much, if at all?

Also, the world has changed in all sorts of subtle ways I think, it also seems to be 'Brit hip' to be seen in a niqab type face mask or perhaps a cowboy face mask (another form of niqab to me) which I've seen a couple of times along our sea front.

Jimmy Durante, the USA comedian springs to mind about the others in the pub, "A wipe of the cuff is enough!" Again yuk!

I also wonder if those people that go to the loo in the pub or motorway service area and never wash their hands are doing it now???
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Percy on 11:44:33, 30/03/20
I’ll tell you what people do appear to be making: bread and cakes.


Flour is the product most consistently stripped from the shelves in the supermarkets round here.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: taxino8 on 11:47:01, 30/03/20
Fortunately for me I found a box of 10 in my shed while I was killing time cleaning it out.
I’ve put one in my car just in case but not been anywhere to use it.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 11:48:01, 30/03/20
If I make a face mask or a niqab (sorry, I meant when my wife makes it for me, I'm confident she will insist!) mine is going to be a silnylon one (it can be washed) and I'll adapt it as necessary. In the lifestyle I lead at the moment I think it might become useful when I go to my local Tesco Express, I would only need it for a few minutes.  ::)

Maybe I'm a bit like Mountaingal, I find it difficult to trust Government with wishy-washy Govey words, (I've spent a lifetime getting excuses and bull from people) are they telling us that masks are useless because they 'forgot' or 'failed' to order any? Of course, they 'forgot/failed' that's what Governments are best at!
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Percy on 12:05:01, 30/03/20

The prevalent wearing of masks in the orient is actually more of a cultural thing.
And was as much about particulate pollution as infectious diseases prior to the last few months.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 12:14:55, 30/03/20
Sorry my sentence should have read -

'I find it difficult to trust Government with their wishy-washy Govey words, (I've spent a lifetime getting excuses and bull from people) are they telling us that masks are useless because they 'forgot, 'failed' or 'didn't think it through' to order any? Of course, they 'forgot/failed and didn't think it through' that's what all Governments are best at!

And now in a real-time of need we in the UK have 'Universal Credit' another idea that was never thought through and I suspect done with malice in mind as well! It's OK, I know I'm biased, I just want a platform to thank Mr. Ian Duncan Smith for his humanity while I can!
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: sparnel on 12:18:01, 30/03/20
Could one - or two - be made out of a bra?
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: strawy on 12:27:45, 30/03/20
Could one - or two - be made out of a bra?


You could only use the left cup,otherwise you,d look like a right t*t  O0
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 12:29:39, 30/03/20
I don't suppose this will help?
https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/advice-for-public/when-and-how-to-use-masks (https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/advice-for-public/when-and-how-to-use-masks)
Or will you ignore it because it is the "establishment"
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 12:35:38, 30/03/20
It does, yes but in my case, I would only consider putting it on when I know I'm going to be face to face with someone, at Tesco Express, for example, I wouldn't bother to wear such a thing if I was to have a stroll along the seafront or when I'm in some other open space.

I think everything, in the end, will depend on if people actually believe that social distancing actually works and the virus does not blow around in the wind. The jury is out on that one for the moment I think.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: archaeoroutes on 12:45:33, 30/03/20
You could only use the left cup,otherwise you,d look like a right t*t  O0
;D
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 12:58:12, 30/03/20
I realise that we are discussing improvising masks but if more people are seen out in them it will encourage others to try to source masks when they do not really need them causing stress and anxiety if they cannot get them and depleting much needed stocks if they do get them, for no great benefit.
Apart from the WHO advice, you might want to look up the current thinking on viral load.  Layman's version here: https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-what-is-viral-load-and-why-does-it-matter-for-covid-19-11963393
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: strawy on 17:57:19, 30/03/20
A few years ago,i worked in a car paint shop,we had standard throw-away masks available,no good at all,depending on the colour/type of paint we sprayed,we still got coloured lips/teeth/hairy nostrils,i always felt like i was suffocating when wearing them,they have probably improved but i cant imagine one of them keeping a virus out..
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 18:01:29, 30/03/20
I was glad to be rid of it at the time. but I miss my S10 respirator now
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S10_NBC_Respirator

The current batch are even better - two canisters now so you don't have to hold your breath any more.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: mountaingal on 18:15:24, 02/04/20
At last, they started talking about face masks on TV and radio ;)  Is it a sign that some might become available to general public ::) ? However, silly people are thinking face mask could replace some measures we have been taking. Definitely NOT! Face mask should be worn As Well As doing all other things,,,washing hands, keeping distance from people around etc etc... I am importing a template and the material from abroad ( my sister offered to send one) ;)  Meanwhile, I can wear one of 3 precious disposable ones I have at the moment.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 18:22:53, 02/04/20
Not needed yet.  Guidance from WHO remains the same at present.  Best advice remains distancing and washing your hands,  It will make you feel better but benefit to you is marginal at best.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: sussamb on 18:48:31, 02/04/20
Agreed, advice at the moment is that it won't help unless you're a health professional used to wearing them and adopting the necessary precautions, social distance and wash hands for the rest of us.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: stally on 19:17:15, 02/04/20
While walking our JR dog,  strangers  always  ask her where she gets her face masks, she tells them she doesn't wear one.  :-[
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: SteamyTea on 08:39:06, 03/04/20
Could one - or two - be made out of a bra?
Lightweightmike seems to use girls tight to make all sorts of things, including supper.
Better stop now.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: BuzyG on 12:50:46, 03/04/20
I was glad to be rid of it at the time. but I miss my S10 respirator now
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S10_NBC_Respirator (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S10_NBC_Respirator)

The current batch are even better - two canisters now so you don't have to hold your breath any more.

I still have my S10 in the garage. 

The care home where MrsG works are now issuing full Hazmat suits in preparation for the worst.  I just hope they never need to use them them. 
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Dodgylegs on 12:58:35, 03/04/20
Was issued with a mask by GP receptionist before appointment, immediately glasses steamed up....
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 13:19:37, 03/04/20
I still have my S10 in the garage. 

The care home where MrsG works are now issuing full Hazmat suits in preparation for the worst.  I just hope they never need to use them them.
One morning I turned up for work at a suddenly eerily quiet Kuwaiti Army base to be issued with an S10 (with no red stripe on the filter) with a suit to match to be told to have it with me at all times.  Apparently, we had mobilised overnight as we were expecting a return visit from Saddam at any time and all the people we were working with had gone to man the barricades.  Since we travelled in plain clothes off-base, it made for an odd rucksack load but it was a comforting weight.  God knows what would have happened if I had got it out and put it on the middle of the souk.
Could do with it now though.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Toxicbunny on 13:00:40, 30/04/20
I have not made any masks as you can buy them. I bought a huge pack of disposable masks and disposable gloves weeks ago. I wear them if I have to go to shops and bin them outside. I have no intention of waiting for the government to tell me to wear them. Judging by the amount of soap and cleaning products sold I can only deduce that some have just discovered what it's for  ^-^ . There are plenty of sewing patterns on the net. But I prefer disposable. The prices have shot up now especially since Scotland have made mask wearing compulsory. 
I suppose mask wearing is a choice and it's down to your circumstances and health.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Mel on 13:12:02, 30/04/20
There was an interview on BBC telly yesterday saying that "a mask" per se, wasn't necessary and that anything could be used as a face covering ( * buff, handkerchief, etc. ).  She also said that the idea of a mask/face covering was to stop you (the wearer) spreading your potentially contaminated breath particles (coughing, sneezing or just breathing/talking) to the air rather than preventing anyone else's from getting into your lungs.






* So.... gimp mask, anyone?

Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 13:13:09, 30/04/20
I made mine but have some disposables as well. I use them when entering shops or when I have to make contact with a client. I am still convinced that the reason why our Government is not advising us to wear them is that they 'forgot' to put an order in and are desperate not to be found out! I worked for the NHS for years and was always given face when we had 'bugs and virus' flying around. I never once to my knowledge caught anything so I was either just lucky or they did work? For me, the issue today is not whether they are medically useful or not, they help psychologically, and they are worn extensively in those countries that are enjoying the best success rates as well.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: tonyk on 13:32:44, 30/04/20
There was an interview on BBC telly yesterday saying that "a mask" per se, wasn't necessary and that anything could be used as a face covering ( * buff, handkerchief, etc. ).  She also said that the idea of a mask/face covering was to stop you (the wearer) spreading your potentially contaminated breath particles (coughing, sneezing or just breathing/talking) to the air rather than preventing anyone else's from getting into your lungs.


 A lot of the masks I have seen people wearing in shops are dust masks rather than medical grade masks.Surely the virus particles would pass through this type of mask and give you a false sense of security? I did notice that some people wearing masks were not alert to what was going on around them,hence the false sense of security.

 



Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 13:37:28, 30/04/20
There is a good programme about mask wearing here, types, pros cons, how to wear etc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v93rcPkFkZc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v93rcPkFkZc)
Well worth a watch.


In summary, mask wearing affords some protection but only if worn correctly and in conjunction with existing social distancing measures. Single use manufactured masks are best if used properly.  Improvised masks are seen as better than nothing but must be washed at 60C after every use.  Wash hands before fitting mask and after removing mask.  Do not touch mask once it is fitted, if you do so inadvertently, clean hands immediately.  Finally, do not go out any more often than you used to. just because you have a mask.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Mel on 14:49:21, 30/04/20
There was an interview on BBC telly yesterday saying that "a mask" per se, wasn't necessary and that anything could be used as a face covering ( * buff, handkerchief, etc. ).  She also said that the idea of a mask/face covering was to stop you (the wearer) spreading your potentially contaminated breath particles (coughing, sneezing or just breathing/talking, laughing) to the air rather than preventing anyone else's from getting into your lungs.

* So.... gimp mask, anyone?


Sorry, I should have clarified.  The BBC interview was the daily morning questions/answers slot where a relevant (non BBC) professional addresses questions sent into the BBC by viewers.
 
The emphasis by this lady (healthcare professional) was on damping down the distance/spread of potentially infected particles in more confined spaces (shops and public transport were used as examples) where social distancing isn’t as easy to maintain, eg. people are moving slower/stationary.
 
It focussed on the Joe Public “breath-outer” damping down their own breath – basically taking ownership / responsibility for reducing YOUR OWN potential spreading of the virus.
 
We have no control over other people’s actions but we do have control over our own.
 
I’ve also edited the list of breath-out reasons to include laughing (which is still allowed). 



Edit:  For those of you who want a laugh/inspiration of "alternative" face coverings, have a look at this topic  :D  :


https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=96808 (https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=96808)


Proving that you can take this pandemic seriously and retain a sense of humour  O0


Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: mountaingal on 14:55:52, 30/04/20
There was an interview on BBC telly yesterday saying that "a mask" per se, wasn't necessary and that anything could be used as a face covering ( * buff, handkerchief, etc. ).  She also said that the idea of a mask/face covering was to stop you (the wearer) spreading your potentially contaminated breath particles (coughing, sneezing or just breathing/talking) to the air rather than preventing anyone else's from getting into your lungs.






* So.... gimp mask, anyone?



That's the idea all along. If you watched the same one as I did..this MP/GP said 'I wear to protect you and you wear to protect me'. Yet people have been debating if a mask protect ME. That's a self centered idea :( . For it to work, everybody should wear to stop anybody's virus getting into the air. If you are unfortunate to be next to somebody in a supermarket or in a train, and if this person suddenly sneezes or cough, (or even talking and spluttering) you'd hope this person wearing a mask instead of everything being dispersed into the air, wouldn't you? I doubt an elbow would cover it enough either.
It's a very stupid idea to think you are safe because you are wearing one and go off guard. I saw a hospital staff in Spain wearing one until she was interviewed, then she took it off to answer the interview! Her saliva would have been spluttering around :o .  Just like washing hands properly, you have to wear it properly and take all other measures. Government and NHS can't tell us to wear one because even NHS can't get one themselves. It's unlikely for UK gov to make it compulsory because government can't provide ones to us like some other countries do. Everybody should do own bit by staying at home, keep 2 meters away and wear a mask (now you have to call it a face covering :P )
By the way, at last, the international post from my sister arrived. Took almost a month instead of normal 3-5 days.  Now I've got the material and a template and made a couple of 3D ones  ;) 
I'm glad I'm not walking in Hyde park / St James park. There are too many people walking, jogging and cycling. Impossible to stay away from each other :o
(https://i.postimg.cc/Bvc4zD2L/IMG-20200427-154009.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 14:58:46, 30/04/20
The problem, especially with improvised masks, is that they are not great at retaining exhaled virons.  They will catch the larger droplets from a cough or sneeze but the over pressure blows the smaller droplets out through the mask or round the sides and subsequent breaths may blow out more, as the pore size is too large and the seal is inadequate.  There is some reduction in aerosol, but not a lot.  This is the basis for the debate.  Wearing improvised masks tempts people into reducing their social distancing and/or outing frequency but their masks are only marginally effective.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: pdstsp on 15:24:23, 30/04/20

I’ve also edited the list of breath-out reasons to include laughing (which is still allowed). 
Edit:  For those of you who want a laugh/inspiration of "alternative" face coverings, have a look at this topic  :D  :
https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=96808 (https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=96808)
Proving that you can take this pandemic seriously and retain a sense of humour  O0


Love Charles T's mask on the walkhighlands forum, Mel. Perhaps we should all get one for the next forum meet.  I think Gunwharfman may like the hat too - he's been looking for one.




Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 15:43:13, 30/04/20

Love Charles T's mask on the walkhighlands forum, Mel. Perhaps we should all get one for the next forum meet.  I think Gunwharfman may like the hat too - he's been looking for one.
Apparently the Norfolk Police are already looking for him
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=facGGkwikLA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=facGGkwikLA)
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: pdstsp on 15:51:12, 30/04/20
Apparently the Norfolk Police are already looking for him
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=facGGkwikLA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=facGGkwikLA)


Looks quite smart.  Might get in the way on steep descents?  Also may prove troublesome when eating cake, so Mel won't be getting one. ;D
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Toxicbunny on 16:29:13, 30/04/20
I made mine but have some disposables as well. I use them when entering shops or when I have to make contact with a client. I am still convinced that the reason why our Government is not advising us to wear them is that they 'forgot' to put an order in and are desperate not to be found out! I worked for the NHS for years and was always given face when we had 'bugs and virus' flying around. I never once to my knowledge caught anything so I was either just lucky or they did work? For me, the issue today is not whether they are medically useful or not, they help psychologically, and they are worn extensively in those countries that are enjoying the best success rates as well.
Totally agree. There was a woman 2m in front of me vaping I had my mask on  in the queue. Some may think they dont help but personally I think they do. I wont go to any shop without one. Anything covering around your mouth and nose is better than just breathing in someone elses coughed virus germs.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 16:53:01, 30/04/20
...  and they are worn extensively in those countries that are enjoying the best success rates as well.
  Er no.  Started and spread in China, Japan has declared a state of emergency - both mask wearing cultures.  Masks were worn extensively in Italy - how did they do?   Germany only introduced them after the rate of infection had already fallen.  Austria likewise.   NZ and Australia are the leaders in elimination of the disease - neither used masks.


If it was that clear cut there would not be a debate. 
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 17:01:17, 30/04/20
Totally agree. There was a woman 2m in front of me vaping I had my mask on  in the queue. Some may think they dont help but personally I think they do. I wont go to any shop without one. Anything covering around your mouth and nose is better than just breathing in someone elses coughed virus germs.
You stood 2m from a person who was vaping - that is what you are supposed to do.  2m is supposed to be the safe distance - it is only 1.5 m in NZ and they have virtually eliminated it.  Incidentally, there viruses and there are germs and germs can be infected by viruses but there is no such thing as a virus germ.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Toxicbunny on 17:10:02, 30/04/20
You stood 2m from a person who was vaping - that is what you are supposed to do.  2m is supposed to be the safe distance - it is only 1.5 m in NZ and they have virtually eliminated it.  Incidentally, there viruses and there are germs and germs can be infected by viruses but there is no such thing as a virus germ.
I'm well aware 2M is considered the safe distance however some believe it should be a larger distance. If someone is vaping and it's a windy day logic tells you those vapours in and out of lungs can carry further. As far as I'm concerned and the terminology I use its germs whether it's a virus or not its contagious hence why I wear a mask in public to my shops.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 17:20:07, 30/04/20
I'm well aware 2M is considered the safe distance however some believe it should be a larger distance. If someone is vaping and it's a windy day logic tells you those vapours in and out of lungs can carry further. As far as I'm concerned and the terminology I use its germs whether it's a virus or not its contagious hence why I wear a mask in public to my shops.
The wind will also cause more mixing thereby diluting the virons.  Look up viral load.
2m is accepted by competent authorities as a safe distance.  As I said, NZ succeeded at 1.5m - their new case count has been in single figures for nearly 2 weeks and the do not insist on masks.  The key is maintaining social distance and good hygiene.


https://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/germ (https://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/germ)
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Toxicbunny on 17:42:24, 30/04/20
The wind will also cause more mixing thereby diluting the virons.  Look up viral load.
2m is accepted by competent authorities as a safe distance.  As I said, NZ succeeded at 1.5m - their new case count has been in single figures for nearly 2 weeks and the do not insist on masks.  The key is maintaining social distance and good hygiene.
New Zealand is a different country they have handled the situation differently to the UK as has Australia.  I dont live in NZ so it's of little interest to me whether they wear masks or not. There is far higher infection and death rate in the UK. It's down to my personal choice to wear a mask to protect myself and family. The wind may well dilute virons however that does not necessarily mean you will get a milder form if you were to catch it.  Wearing a mask in areas where lots of people are for example supermarkets and shops where others take no heed of social distances is the safe thing to do.
The  NHS staff wear masks so they dont catch it. I will continue to do so. If you dont want to wear a mask then you dont have to. PPE in many buisnesses has been issued not just the NHS.  I'm not a virologist and I don't think qualified virolgists even known fully about this virus nor pandemic yet.
Boris discussed sage tonight on the BBC broadcast and face coverings tonight on his  broadcast personally I think they will advise people to wear them. It will be discussed by him more next week in phase two.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 18:09:39, 30/04/20
By all means wear a mask - I do not and never did have a problem with that.  Watch the programme I linked to in and be aware it is not the panacea that you seem to suggest or even close.  Here is the link again and bear in mind the trial in Hong Kong referred is for correctly worn surgical masks.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v93rcPkFkZc 
If you wear a mask you need to be well informed of its limitations and how to use it to best effect to keep you and other people safe.
In other posts I have previously inked to another study relating specifically to improvised masks which described them as better than nothing, but not much.
The results from NZ and Australia should interest you.  They show what can be done by effective social distancing, prompt government action and the benefits of tracking and tracing.  If that does not convince you, have a look at the international data published on https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/. There you can compare and contrast nations for yourself.  Have a look at the nations that have introduced mandatory masking and see if you can spot the effect in any of the graphs following the point when it was introduced.
Finally, at the Dowining St briefing today, the scientific evidence in favour of mandatory masking was again described as weak and any benefits were more likely to be psychological rather actual.
The rate of infection can only be reduced by rigorous social distancing, meticulous hygiene, tracking and tracing and isolation of cases.


Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 18:23:46, 30/04/20
Whatever the evidence I suspect that the political message will be for us to wear masks as a routine very soon. Other parties like the SNP seem to be nudging the UK Government in this direction, which I think perhaps is designed to make it appear that Mr. Johnson's crew are following events rather than leading from the front? In the area where I live most people seem to be wearing masks already.

Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Mel on 18:44:00, 30/04/20

Love Charles T's mask on the walkhighlands forum, Mel. Perhaps we should all get one for the next forum meet.  I think Gunwharfman may like the hat too - he's been looking for one.


I actually went for a walk round Beverley with a guy who was wearing one of those masks on (don't ask)  :D


...Also may prove troublesome when eating cake, so Mel won't be getting one. ;D


Oi  >:(  (but so true  ;D  )



Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Toxicbunny on 19:02:24, 30/04/20
Whatever the evidence I suspect that the political message will be for us to wear masks as a routine very soon. Other parties like the SNP seem to be nudging the UK Government in this direction, which I think perhaps is designed to make it appear that Mr. Johnson's crew are following events rather than leading from the front? In the area where I live most people seem to be wearing masks already.
Yes I believe that it will be compulsory for us too. If the NHS wear them then it's for a reason.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 19:14:45, 30/04/20
Yes I believe that it will be compulsory for us too. If the NHS wear them then it's for a reason.
They do wear them for a reason - but not the same reason, they are working in a clinical context.  If they were completely effective though, there would be far fewer casualties amongst them.  They also wear eye protection and scrubs.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Toxicbunny on 19:29:38, 30/04/20
They do wear them for a reason - but not the same reason, they are working in a clinical context.  If they were completely effective though, there would be far fewer casualties amongst them.  They also wear eye protection and scrubs.
In my opinion masks and disposable gloves while out shopping is a step to prevent catching it. I would not put my trust in other peoples hygiene or social distancing.



https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/health-51205344
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Bigfoot_Mike on 19:30:40, 30/04/20
Living in Scotland, I saw the announcement by Nicola Sturgeon and masks are not compulsory in Scotland. Face coverings (2 layers of material) are recommended in enclosed spaces, such as public transport and shops, where their effect may be to reduce to some degree transmission of the virus from an infected person, while having very little if any protective effect to the wearer.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Bigfoot_Mike on 19:33:10, 30/04/20
In my opinion masks and disposable gloves while out shopping is a step to prevent catching it. I would not put my trust in other peoples hygiene or social distancing.



https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/health-51205344 (https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/health-51205344)
Unless you are properly wearing a N95 mask and don’t touch your face, you are unlikely to gain any significant benefit from a mask. There is probably a higher risk of a problem due to relaxing of social distancing and contamination of hands and face from the mask.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 19:58:09, 30/04/20
In my opinion masks and disposable gloves while out shopping is a step to prevent catching it. I would not put my trust in other peoples hygiene or social distancing.



https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/health-51205344 (https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/health-51205344)
Surface contamination is an issue as there is no option but to touch things when shopping.  Gloves are a good idea.  The thing with disposable gloves is they have to be removed correctly to prevent contaminating your skin and the used gloves are a potential biohazard so have to be stored and disposed of appropriately.  They can also puncture or rip easily.  For this reason, I wear a set of black rubber household gloves which I disinfect with bleach spray between uses when I am out.  I can remove and replace them without touching the outsides so I can still drive my car.  I always clean my hands each time with an antiviral hand cleaner as well.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Toxicbunny on 20:10:03, 30/04/20
Unless you are properly wearing a N95 mask and don’t touch your face, you are unlikely to gain any significant benefit from a mask. There is probably a higher risk of a problem due to relaxing of social distancing and contamination of hands and face from the mask.
Getting hold of N95s is difficult at the moment but I do have some.  They are the best. The social distancing just does not sink in with some people.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 20:20:07, 30/04/20
So is the message that with a face mask on, gloves on, and social distancing we are invincible?
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 20:22:41, 30/04/20
I must admit that video does look a bit like me.  8)
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 20:26:24, 30/04/20
So is the message that with a face mask on, gloves on, and social distancing we are invincible?
If only - doesn't help the poor NHS and they get visors and scrubs too.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 20:29:49, 30/04/20
I saw what I believe to be an interesting article today -

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/apr/30/the-guardian-view-on-johnsons-covid-19-plan-doubt-deny-and-dismiss
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 20:47:38, 30/04/20
I saw what I believe to be an interesting article today -

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/apr/30/the-guardian-view-on-johnsons-covid-19-plan-doubt-deny-and-dismiss
It is not as if they did not know they were ill prepared. 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/03/28/exercise-cygnus-uncovered-pandemic-warnings-buried-government/
Austerity and Brexit have a lot to answer for.  The former mean they did not invest when they could have and the latter caused them to take their eye off the ball.  Throw in hubris and you have a recipe for disaster.


My S-i-L is part of the military trying to sort the mess out.  Even at this stage the NHS do not seem to have a plan.  He is chasing about trying to source things only for the NHS staff to change their mind after all the arrangements have been made, or they fail to follow up and arrange collection of the deliveries he has arranged.  Another contact is involved in building Nightingale Hospitals, he says plans are being changed even as they are being built resulting in a lot of nugatory work.
I watched Boris answering questions tonight - long on waffle, short on facts and taking responsibility.  I found myself longing for Dominic.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Toxicbunny on 20:49:02, 30/04/20
So is the message that with a face mask on, gloves on, and social distancing we are invincible?
Unfortunately not but we can only try. O0 
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: fit old bird on 10:21:22, 01/05/20
I made a face mask yesterday, wore it when I was shopping in Aldi. I was the only person with a mask on. I felt it was better to have some kind of barrier across my face when among people, better than nothing at all.

It was a bit uncomfortable. Had to make it to fasten at the back with Velcro. Elastic around the ears is no good for me with specs and a hearing aid. I will wear it again when near people.

ilona
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 11:17:14, 01/05/20
I made a face mask yesterday, wore it when I was shopping in Aldi. I was the only person with a mask on. I felt it was better to have some kind of barrier across my face when among people, better than nothing at all.

It was a bit uncomfortable. Had to make it to fasten at the back with Velcro. Elastic around the ears is no good for me with specs and a hearing aid. I will wear it again when near people.

ilona
Therein lies the issue.  People make their own masks and feel better wearing them because they think they afford some protection whereas the evidence is that homemade masks provide very little protection.  They have an inadequate seal and are made of the wrong kinds of material to act as an effective filter.  Moreover, people fiddle with the fit and touch their faces without sanitising their hands and start getting closer because they feel protected.
HMG needs to reinforce the message that masks are not a substitute for effective social distancing and good hygiene.  Nor are they an excuse to go out on non essential journeys.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Toxicbunny on 11:40:51, 01/05/20

HMG needs to reinforce the message that masks are not a substitute for effective social distancing and good hygiene.  Nor are they an excuse to go out on non essential journeys.
You can reinforce all you like social distancing but many do not observe it the same goes for good hygiene and non essential journeys. I would not trust "others". You need to look after yourself and not rely on others washing their hands or keeping their distance.
I know people in my village  who are making home made masks for the NHS and carers due to lack of PPE
 The government also addressed the fact that face coverings are useful last night.
https://news.sky.com/story/amp/coronavirus-face-coverings-useful-when-uk-lockdown-is-eased-says-boris-johnson-11981298





Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 12:28:30, 01/05/20
From your link


"Health Secretary Matt Hancock said there was only "weak science" supporting advice from the Scottish government that people should wear face coverings in shops and on public transport"


"She had said Sage found there was "weak evidence of a small effect in which a face mask can prevent a source of infection going from somebody who is infected to the people around them"."The answer is clear that the evidence is weak and the effect is small, and we have passed that on to our colleagues in government with which to make a decision," she said."


The science has not changed.  The benefit is weak and as Boris said when we was winging his reply:"I do think face coverings will be useful, both for epidemiological reasons but, also, for giving people confidence that they can go back to work."
The epidemiology tells us improvised masks are not a substitute for social distancing but may proper masks in a confined space are useful.  The telling part of Boris' statement is the last part.  It is to give people confidence -i.e. con them.
If the government mandate the wearing of proper masks, that is acceptable.  There is still a risk but it is much reduced if it is accompanied by an education programme on their correct wearing and use.  It they advocate improvised masks as an acceptable substitute without stressing the need to distance, they are putting people at risk.  Now please, before you argue again, go and do your own research.

Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: richardh1905 on 12:39:30, 01/05/20
It they advocate improvised masks as an acceptable substitute without stressing the need to distance, they are putting people at risk.


Indeed.
I see no harm in wearing an improvised face mask as a means of somewhat reducing the chances of the wearer passing on the virus to others, but any marginal benefit will be undone if people relax other precautions, such as hand washing, maintaining 2m distancing etc.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: sussamb on 12:40:04, 01/05/20
If anything you wearing a mask protects others, it's generally more dangerous to the wearer than not wearing one  ;)


Note I'm talking about the general population here, not those in certain settings like hospitals etc
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Bhod on 12:46:36, 01/05/20
The governments advisory committee SAGE, isn't the best informed, Academically brilliant, Professional body it should be.  Any so called "Scientific" body appointed by government, that has Political advisors involved in it and is basically nothing more than a bunch of number crunchers (statisticians), who won't submit it's discussions and minutes of meetings for public scrutiny actually smacks of a "well if it all goes t*ts up we'll have a someone else to blame scenario".  No wonder all its so called members are being given the anonimity card to play.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 13:03:56, 01/05/20
I find this site interesting.
https://covid.joinzoe.com/data (https://covid.joinzoe.com/data)
It has limitations as it cannot show asymptomatic individuals and relies on self reporting.  IIRC a study conducted by the team showed that a little over half of those who reported themselves symptomatic actually had Covid-19.  I do not know how that has changed over time.


However I find it encouraging that in my area for example, only 6 in a 1000 are reporting symptoms.  It means if I limit my outings to the necessities and stay away from others as far as possible, I am unlikely to even encounter somebody with Covid-19, let alone be in contact with them long enough to catch it.  That is what I am telling myself anyway.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Toxicbunny on 13:41:18, 01/05/20
From your link

The science has not changed.  The benefit is weak and as Boris said when we was winging his reply:"I do think face coverings will be useful, both for epidemiological reasons but, also, for giving people confidence that they can go back to work."
The epidemiology tells us improvised masks are not a substitute for social distancing but may proper masks in a confined space are useful.  The telling part of Boris' statement is the last part.  It is to give people confidence -i.e. con them.
If the government mandate the wearing of proper masks, that is acceptable.  There is still a risk but it is much reduced if it is accompanied by an education programme on their correct wearing and use.  It they advocate improvised masks as an acceptable substitute without stressing the need to distance, they are putting people at risk.  Now please, before you argue again, go and do your own research.
Before you tell someone to stop arguing and do research you should apply that statement to yourself. You should also accept the fact others have a different opinion than you do. I do not need to conduct any research. I keep up to date with everything. Trying to belittle me on a public forum just because I don't agree with you is childish and it will not change my opinion on wearing a facemask. You are free to do what you wish however learn to accept others will do what they wish.  I will wear a mask and disposable gloves as in my experience other people are not following social distancing rules. I have nothing else to say on this matter. I will leave you to argue with yourself as I wont change my opinion on it.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: sussamb on 13:57:34, 01/05/20
I watched someone leave a supermarket last week wearing gloves and a mask.  As he approached his car he put his hand in his pocket, pulled out his car keys, held them in his mouth and then removed his gloves and mask. No doubt he felt safe  ;D
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: forgotmyoldpassword on 14:38:39, 01/05/20
I find this site interesting.
https://covid.joinzoe.com/data (https://covid.joinzoe.com/data)
It has limitations as it cannot show asymptomatic individuals and relies on self reporting.  IIRC a study conducted by the team showed that a little over half of those who reported themselves symptomatic actually had Covid-19.  I do not know how that has changed over time.


However I find it encouraging that in my area for example, only 6 in a 1000 are reporting symptoms.  It means if I limit my outings to the necessities and stay away from others as far as possible, I am unlikely to even encounter somebody with Covid-19, let alone be in contact with them long enough to catch it.  That is what I am telling myself anyway.


Currently we have about 4% of the population having had it - which you could extrapolate from a 1% mortality being somewhat consistent across nations and the death figures reported.  If we're seeing 6/1000 reporting symptoms you could extrapolate that circa 75% are asymptomatic if we assume there is a hospitalisation rate of 5%.  This would be surprisingly close to the British Medical Journal's reported 78% of cases being asymptomatic.  If anything we can expect the asymptomatic to improve thanks to South Korea and Germany with their expansive test setup and in particular the young age of most of those tested. (https://theconversation.com/coronavirus-bmj-study-suggests-78-dont-show-symptoms-heres-what-that-could-mean-135732 (https://theconversation.com/coronavirus-bmj-study-suggests-78-dont-show-symptoms-heres-what-that-could-mean-135732) )

The governments advisory committee SAGE, isn't the best informed, Academically brilliant, Professional body it should be.  Any so called "Scientific" body appointed by government, that has Political advisors involved in it and is basically nothing more than a bunch of number crunchers (statisticians), who won't submit it's discussions and minutes of meetings for public scrutiny actually smacks of a "well if it all goes t*ts up we'll have a someone else to blame scenario".  No wonder all its so called members are being given the anonimity card to play.



As someone involved with statistics many business discussions over the years have been clients trying to discern 'what is the bottom line' whilst ignoring everything else.  Only a select few are interested in methods or limitations, they make a judgement on that 'bottom line' based on how charismatic you are, how professional you appear, and your CV.  Which is exactly what I imagine you'd get from the press and public if this was to be made public and advice had to be individually 'judged' based on how much they like a particular scientist's face or their dress sense. 


They don't want or need to learn much about the limitations of and how many forms of prediction are imperfect by their very nature due to them potentially being based on bad data.  The method needs to evolve, the data sets need to be updated and doing this in a 'no blame' culture, internally, allows those models to be explored and perfected far more easily and quickly than having the government PR machine wasting time and energy in managing the public response as these are published. 


To use an analogy, when you are in hospital for something serious - doctors have a morning meeting where they discuss the treatment plan for their patients and their prognoses.  They don't invite the family in to the discussion unless it's clinically relevant because they aren't medically trained, and they are unlikely to understand much of the terminology and be able to contribute to the discussion due to not having understanding of the physiology of the body either.  I'm not sure patients or patient family demanding to be admitted to these discussions would be reasonable.  The same is true of public scrutiny of SAGE.


If discussions need to be had on the political impact of, for example, asking schools to re-open (at a potential cost of circa 1300 school children dying before we have a vaccine) - no politician is going to sign 1300+ children's death warrants and if the press/public start objecting to this then it does not help the situation.  However there are also other undesirable effects from remaining in lockdown I'm sure the modelers are working on understanding more in depth - an important point made during yesterday's briefing by the CSO was that 'comparisons should be made afterwards, based on excess deaths from all causes adjusted by age'.  That sentence alone should tell you that the modelling teams are looking at cancer, depression, domestic abuse, accidents, poverty, heart attacks, strokes, etc and of course COVID and trying to sail the ship on a narrow course to reduce all of these factors as much as possible.  You could say that the goal of the government isn't to minimise COVID deaths, but to minimise all causes of deaths even if this means having an inflated R-value (rate at which the virus reproduces) compared to other countries for a period of time.  This appears to be the Swedish model the UK very nearly went with originally until the modelers realised the vastly different population densities would likely give very different outcomes.


Before you tell someone to stop arguing and do research you should apply that statement to yourself. You should also accept the fact others have a different opinion than you do. I do not need to conduct any research. I keep up to date with everything. Trying to belittle me on a public forum just because I don't agree with you is childish and it will not change my opinion on wearing a facemask. You are free to do what you wish however learn to accept others will do what they wish.  I will wear a mask and disposable gloves as in my experience other people are not following social distancing rules. I have nothing else to say on this matter. I will leave you to argue with yourself as I wont change my opinion on it.



Looking at Germany mandating mask use and South Korea's adoption of it alongside other Asian nations (who had SARS-1 and MERS to content with) perhaps they know something we don't as to how this can be managed in the longer term.

From what I understand of it you're both right in a way, there are meant to be very limited benefits from wearing a standard face mask if your goal is to avoid catching the virus.  If you have one and you want to do it when you shop or when you're travelling on the tube (if you have to do so for work, for example) then it probably makes good sense to do so - however it won't be anything like a guarantee and you're probably better off washing your hands more often/not touching your face at all.  The key seems to be not adjusting your mask and not wearing it below your nose then fiddling around with it!


That said, if the asymptomatic rate is as high as some studies are reporting - wearing a mask is actually far more likely to reduce the spread from yourself to others when you're out and about if you have it but only a very mild case.  If we're still coughing and sneezing on people and feeling more or less fine perhaps someone might put it down to just clearing your throat, but this may be far more useful broadly speaking as a society and what SK and Germany are judging their decisions on.  I know in South Korea and Singapore in particular all public buildings and many work places use temperature monitoring to try and quarantine those employees who start showing symptoms early - and masks are a key part of reducing the spread before they start showing definite symptoms.


Definitely interesting times with a lot of changes to get used to.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 17:06:39, 01/05/20
If one looks at the countries that have been "successful" in tackling Covid-19, some have used lock downs, some have not, some have mandatory masking, others do not and others have changed policy halfway through.  The one thing they all seem to do have in common is an aggressive policy of testing, tracking and tracing coupled with effective isolation of the infected.  This is relatively easy to do when the infection rate is low and most of these countries got on top of it and stayed on top of it e.g. Germany.  The problem occurs when the infection rate accelerates and starts to get away.  This happened both in South Korea and in the UK.


In the UK, the government was unable to test at anything like the required rate and abandoned all pretence of track and trace, flirted with the idea of herd immunity for a while and then when for a lock down.  In contrast, South Korea stuck with it and redoubled their efforts to catch up  with and break the chains of infection.  As I understand it, this not only included test, track and trace but also proper isolation of the infected.  As a result, S Korea never had a lock down but now has no indigenous cases.


Now that the infection rate is falling in the UK, it is playing catch up with test track and trace.  In my opinion this is the best approach and without it all other measures are just window dressing.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: pleb on 17:29:47, 01/05/20
If this tracking app thing comes in it may be the thing that finally prompts me to get a smartphone, so I can play ball.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: gunwharfman on 17:47:26, 01/05/20
The most 'important article' I've read today is how to stop a facemask hurting your ears!

I won't bore you with it but I'll post if it's important to someone?
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 17:49:41, 01/05/20
The most 'important article' I've read today is how to stop a facemask hurting your ears!

I won't bore you with it but I'll post if it's important to someone?
Loosen each ear back half a turn?  Pad the loops? Use thicker loops? Glue it to your face and dispense with the loops altogether?  Paperclip through both loops? ;)
Little known medical fact - headaches are often caused by having your ears on too tight.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: sussamb on 17:56:53, 01/05/20
The most 'important article' I've read today is how to stop a facemask hurting your ears!


It's simple enough, don't wear one  :)
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: Bigfoot_Mike on 19:55:26, 01/05/20
BBC reported on the SK track and trace and said that following MERS it enacted pretty draconian laws. These enable tracking through bank accounts and other ways that would probably never be acceptable in the UK. So, it appears that SK has a head start that we couldn’t ever hope to follow.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 20:14:40, 01/05/20
BBC reported on the SK track and trace and said that following MERS it enacted pretty draconian laws. These enable tracking through bank accounts and other ways that would probably never be acceptable in the UK. So, it appears that SK has a head start that we couldn’t ever hope to follow.
It is not so much through bank accounts but places where your bank card has been used as I understand it.  An article from mid March here  https://theconversation.com/coronavirus-south-koreas-success-in-controlling-disease-is-due-to-its-acceptance-of-surveillance-134068 (https://theconversation.com/coronavirus-south-koreas-success-in-controlling-disease-is-due-to-its-acceptance-of-surveillance-134068)
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: barewirewalker on 09:33:40, 02/05/20
Just come in from the shed, must have made my 16th, or @ that, disposable face mask for Mrs BWW for her bi-weekly visit to her 101 year old mother. It passes muster for someone, who has worked as an acute surgical nurse for 50 years. May not be a true safe guard against Covid 19, but if we get to the stage that we are required wear something on let out at least I know I can knock up a useful facsimile in about 10 minutes. Reading most of the above I will not be relying on it anymore than a necessary piece of uniform compliant with the times. As I don't suppose any really effective products will be available to the masses at affordable prices and the reality will be overpriced fakes with bogus quality advertising!!
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: sussamb on 09:52:13, 02/05/20
... I don't suppose any really effective products will be available to the masses at affordable prices and the reality will be overpriced fakes with bogus quality advertising!!


Agreed, if the government insists on us wearing masks, which I don't believe will happen, I'll just wear my buff/old Army headover ....
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: fit old bird on 09:53:06, 02/05/20
Therein lies the issue.  People make their own masks and feel better wearing them because they think they afford some protection whereas the evidence is that homemade masks provide very little protection.  They have an inadequate seal and are made of the wrong kinds of material to act as an effective filter.  Moreover, people fiddle with the fit and touch their faces without sanitising their hands and start getting closer because they feel protected.
HMG needs to reinforce the message that masks are not a substitute for effective social distancing and good hygiene.  Nor are they an excuse to go out on non essential journeys.

Stoopid idea then. I will bin my mask.

ilona
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 11:45:31, 02/05/20
I saw two bemasked individuals that I had not seen before striding down the village street today wearing some kind of filter mask.  The masks came complete with an exhaust valve so the protection afforded to anyone else from their exhalations was zero but neither of them bothered to pass 2m away, presumably because they felt protected from we non mask wearing peons,
It was a lovely sunny day too with a gentle breeze so there was no need for a mask at all, had they kept 2m away, so that is 2 more masks wasted.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: richardh1905 on 12:14:19, 02/05/20
Stoopid idea then. I will bin my mask.

ilona


Not a stupid idea at all Ilona, as long as you wear your mask in addition to the other precautions that you are already taking - You may be slightly reducing the risk of you passing on the virus to others, should you unknowingly have it.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: richardh1905 on 12:15:11, 02/05/20

Agreed, if the government insists on us wearing masks, which I don't believe will happen, I'll just wear my buff/old Army headover ....


A buff will suffice for me - not that I expect it to do much good.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 12:34:29, 02/05/20

A buff will suffice for me - not that I expect it to do much good.
I am torn between a buff and doing a Billy the Kid with an old ski scarf.  I think the latter would go better with my Tilley.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 12:43:15, 02/05/20

Agreed, if the government insists on us wearing masks, which I don't believe will happen, I'll just wear my buff/old Army headover ....

A buff will suffice for me - not that I expect it to do much good.
Just a thought - will a buff stand a hot (60C) wash or will it ruin it?  Might have to be my skiing tea towel.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: fit old bird on 14:10:12, 02/05/20

Not a stupid idea at all Ilona, as long as you wear your mask in addition to the other precautions that you are already taking - You may be slightly reducing the risk of you passing on the virus to others, should you unknowingly have it.

Hi Richard, thank you for your reply. I know all about the additional precautions, which I do follow, and will be following after all this is over. My comment was a tongue in cheek retaliation  because I am fed up of being preached at by those who think they know it all, and think everyone else is thick.

ilona
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: ninthace on 15:20:28, 02/05/20
I wasn't criticising you Ilona, but there are those out there who genuinely are thick - I've seen them, in fact I saw another 2 today,  masks on, ignoring the 2m rule - I'm alright Jack attitude.
Title: Re: Are you making your own face masks or anything else?
Post by: sussamb on 17:02:37, 02/05/20
 O0