Author Topic: Why is there so much anger around country paths?  (Read 4105 times)

Roburite

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I read this in the Guardian this morning. It was written by Patrick Barkham, a natural history writer. A lot of interesting comment is building so I'll include the link at the bottom. Do forum readers agree that there is anger around country paths?
 
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When the Ramblers Association recently launched its Big Pathwatch, urging walkers to upload pictures of overgrown footpaths, I considered it a bit silly. Poor hard-pressed councils tasked with footpath maintenance – can’t walkers stamp down a few stray nettles? After a stinging wade along the bridleways of Buckinghamshire, however, I’m all for app tale-telling. It wasn’t just fast-growing nettles and brambles but teasels, thistles, young oaks and hogweed as high as a horse. And this 35 miles from London, in the Tory shires, where keen trampers take to the lanes in battalions and steel swing gates have been installed in memory of members of the local U3A group.
Apart from council cuts, the problem appears to be that many landowners regard footpaths as an unfortunate relic from pre-enclosure days, when peasants swarmed unimpeded across the countryside. Virtually every fence has a warning sign attached. “Private” (it’s really obvious where the footpath goes), “Beware of the bull” (there never is one) or “Vermin control in progress”.
To be fair, most notices plead with walkers to stop their dogs harassing sheep and cows. But even these can be forbidding. “Please don’t let me GET SHOT” said one sign alongside an image of a cute Jack Russell, holding a lead – rather than the usual bleeding sheep’s head – between its teeth.
A few Farmer Palmers – the gun-toting Viz stereotype – prefer the unwritten sign. In the Chilterns, one demonstrated his contempt for the ancient right of way wiggling through his farmyard by dumping a load of manure over it. Further on, two dead crows had been left on the path.
  <blockquote> I am a country person but, at times, Buckinghamshire felt bristlingly hostile
 </blockquote>  As I waded through a fourth field of thigh-high wheat, I didn’t curse the farmers for sowing across the path (they can’t fiddle about cutting paths for my enjoyment) but silently blamed local residents for not walking these routes. They’d be kept open if regularly trodden. Use it or lose it.
But perhaps people aren’t footing our paths because of the cumulative effect of all these signs. I am a country person but, at times, Buckinghamshire felt bristlingly hostile. This is a shame because when I actually bumped into rural landowners, they were always friendly and interesting. They channel rage into the signs.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/sep/01/anger-country-paths-landowners




barewirewalker

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #1 on: 08:45:20, 02/09/15 »
I think the people of this country have probably got the access network they deserve, the state of the existing network is the the result of expecting local government to pick up the tab (whatever it might be!) but leave yourself off the list of getting involved.


Volunteers are now doing a lot of the work on the access network, these are local groups, how much support do they get from a much larger part of the electorate ? Or I suspect many users of the walking network.


On the other hand this article is perhaps a sign that the press are waking up to the problem, sadly the content of the article is that of a modern day reporter who expects his story to written for him and not the story he should have researched and discovered for himself.

Do I agree; Their is more than manifests itself openly in the anti-access lobby and not enough based on sound fact based logic on the pro-access side.


The CLA have been stoking the fire of discontent among their membership ever since 2000 and the Crow Act, it manifest itself in disguised forms such as the article suggests but 'Palmer Farmer' is more prevalent than than he thinks, having been one of their number, I can pick up the vibes that others might not.


How many have read the CLA's (organization that lobbies for Landowner's interests) Policy on Access. An intellectually challenged document that does not accept any blame for a situation the landowners created. Had this reporter thought to read it, then he might have a bit more understanding of the question he poses.



« Last Edit: 08:53:59, 02/09/15 by barewirewalker »
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wintonian

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #2 on: 12:34:09, 02/09/15 »
Highways have been maintainable by the 'inhabitants at large' since the 16th century, although this has in most cases been replaced by them being maintainable at public expense (some are instead privately maintainable or maintainable by no-one). By using volunteer groups for example we seem to in effect be going full circle, and without going through any parliamentary process like that which removed the responsibility from the inhabitants at large in the first place. After all this government seems rather keen on divesting the state of responsibility hoping the third sector will pick up the pieces.

As for the CLA they are increasingly annoying me (who's members divested themselves of any social responsibility long ago) and as such I'm off to the county records office in a bit to scrutinise some tithe maps to see if I can find something going right past their front door. Mind you I don't think I have the brain for this I just seem to get more confused as I go along.  :-\
« Last Edit: 12:48:50, 02/09/15 by wintonian »

barewirewalker

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #3 on: 08:09:05, 03/09/15 »
 As for the CLA they are increasingly annoying me (who's members divested themselves of any social responsibility long ago) and as such I'm off to the county records office in a bit to scrutinise some tithe maps to see if I can find something going right past their front door.  
 


Do you wonder why the CLA are so anti-access, when visitors to the countryside bring so much revenue into the rural economy? Scotland has proved this, figures used by the Scottish Mountaineering Council referred to here;
http://www.walkingforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=26296.0
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in 2009 the value to the Scottish economy from walking tourism was estimated to be £533m a year.

The MCofS said, according to Scottish Natural Heritage, the overall contribution to the Scottish economy from all field sports – game shooting, deer stalking and angling – is £136m a year.
Demonstrates this.





Ask why we are getting more of this, than the old "Trespasser will be prosecuted" boards nailed on trees around


I can remember when this was a popular picnic spot, used by families who used the bus to come out of town, there is a shingle beach under the bank where the river turns into the bridge. Rather than allow access to the river bank which would open up a way  that would lead across the Estate by a lost way to quiet lanes, the landowner chooses to force no access.


The reason is, I suspect, that pandering to the property owner's baser instincts of selfishness is a better way of recruiting membership.


In the 1970's - 80's I noticed that the CLA started to recruit the sons of successful tenant farming families, who had worked in their family farm businesses, as membership salesmen, this was to increase the CLA membership beyond their traditional recruiting of aristocracy and long hereditary tenure of land. Why? It coincided with the trimming of hereditary peerages in the House of Lords.


A true farmer should actually be in favour of access, it is natural for a producers to want to have a good relationship with their customers. Large chunks of the countryside that do not have access will affect the geography of the access network and therefore have impact on the public perception of the landowners/producers in that area.


The CLA is not a producer organisation, it is the NFU who is the lobbyist for the farmer and sadly this organisation has not grasped the simple fact that they should not duplicate the thinking of the CLA.


When I was a group chairman in the NFU we were active in one of the first "Buy British" campaigns, since then the British Farmer has repeated appealed to the British public to support home grown food. It is curious that the "Ramblers" do not lobby for access rights with a strategy that divides the farmer from the landowner.

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altirando

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #4 on: 00:47:27, 05/09/15 »
I live cheek by jowl with farmers.  A trail alongside my garden leads to a footpath across to Whitegate Way, signposted turn off.  The house just past there was owned by a retired farmer who sometimes had children in tears who had missed the path turn off.  I think once blasted a dog with shotgun pellets who had strayed from the direct line.  Now departed from this earth fortunately.  The problem with many rural paths is that they led to farms and houses, not past them, so it is understandable if they are sometimes seen as intrusive. Another local farmer planted potatoes on ridges near me, right across a well used public path. Eventually marked the diagonal line of the path by driving his tractor across the field.  But not only farmers, again near me is a very large Scout weekend camping area.  A popular stroll for locals is alongside a small lake on the edge of the large area.  R.o.w must have been established years ago.  But every few years bigger barricades go up across any access points. These same Scouts hold disco evenings in the summer until midnight so loud I can hear them over a mile away. Think I will move into a suburb, quieter.

barewirewalker

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #5 on: 08:59:40, 05/09/15 »
I woke up this morning thinking about the OP;  
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Do forum readers agree that there is anger around country paths?


Might be sad but I think it was triggered off by thinking about 'Downton Gorge' mentioned here;
http://www.walkingforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=30667.0


Thanks Altirando for reminding me of it, I am pondering it as a suitable walk today and as it is a trespass I run the risk of triggering off some anger, which reminded me of a farmer who stood in front of me literally trembling with suppressed anger.
 
I had been exploring an area west of Welshpool, some years ago, we had covered most of the hills around Meifod and the sections of the Vyrnwy that had produced interesting circular routes. My attention was drawn to an area were RoWs converged on a crossing of the river Vyrnwy but no bridge was marked and there wasn't a ford. I planned a circular route leading to Cilmawr, were the map shows a convergence of bridleway and footpath. The start of the actual approach to the river crossing point was at Lower Gwern-y-Cil, where walked into a farmyard that was clearly a RoW on the map but no way marks.


We were given a rather hard look by a young woman driving a car out of the lane as we approached and an elderly farmer appeared out of the house as we were passing. We naturally stopped to talk and to his question where we were going I told him we were following the footpath and some general polite chat.


I tend laugh quite alot and did have interject a laugh into the conversation, I suppose in an attempt to keep the meeting light hearted, but at some point I noticed Mrs BWW taking over the conversation. Now this lady is a very experienced nurse, attuned to body language, this drew my attention to the fact that the farmer was literally trembling with suppressed rage and due to his age going dangerously white in the face. We assume that my laughter was interpreted as a laugh at himself, the confrontation was calmed down. However the underlying problem was the farmer thought that by walking a route that no one else had used in a long time we were opening up the RoW.


He was a good farmer, as we walked across his land I noticed his hedges, tight thorn hedges managed to keep cattle in, cut in the spring so that the thorn spreads sideways producing a lattice of thorn across the surface of the hedge and not a single weed plant such as nut or elder in the hedges. I realised that if there were not stiles at the field boundaries we were going to have to retrace our steps and walk back through that farmer's yard with out tails between our legs.


However that old right of way led across the farm to every gateway and when we came to the boundary hedge the line of way led to an Oak tree with post and rails. This taught me something about RoW's, we arrived at Cilmawr to meet a farmer who was totally different, he was very friendly and of  a similar age. He had retired and his land was being let out to a neighbour. His building had been turned into good quality holiday lets but as his daughter's marriage had failed she was living there.


Now the river crossing, there used to be a bridge, during the 1962-3 winter the build up of ice and snow from that long winter had swept the bridge away during the thaw, this farmer showed us a framed photo of the bridge. So we did not make a crossing of the River Vyrnwy and carried on with the planned circular route I had originally planned.


Had we managed to cross the river the right of way (never used) would have lead through an intensive dairy farm and that farmer I was told would have gone 'loopy' if he had found us using the path.


If the bridge was ever rebuilt or a crossing made to make those RoW usable, I believe the river crossing at Cilmawr would be an important feature in a cross Wales route as it would make a pure countryside walk from Welshpool to Llanfyllin possible.


Any one taking interest in this might find it interesting to link it with my thoughts on the Maginnis Bridge expressed here;


http://www.walkingforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=30662.0
BWW
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Snowman

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #6 on: 16:00:36, 26/09/15 »
From GOV.UK:


As the owner or occupier of land with a PROW across it, you must keep the route visible and not obstruct or endanger users.  


So it is ultimately the landowner's responsibility to maintain rights of way, it's just that some landowners hate having to share their land with anyone.


My 'walking base' is the Chilterns, where the majority of landowners behaviour is praiseworthy.    However move a few miles west into Oxfordshire and you'd think the landowners had come from a different planet.


What really annoys me though is that in bygone days, we could do something about it.    When I was in the Scouts, it was quite normal for one of us to carry a machete so that if you encountered an overgrown path, you could clear it yourself.   These days you have to run the gauntlet of stinging nettles and brambles, and grin and bear it just because a few mindless oiks thought that instead of knives being a tool, they'd be useful to kill people.    Unfortunately while the laws on carrying knives have become more stringent, no-one has bothered to similarly strengthen the onus on landowners to maintain ROWs.


Oh well, so much for progress.






wintonian

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #7 on: 18:16:44, 26/09/15 »
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However move a few miles west into Oxfordshire and you'd think the landowners had come from a different planet.

Particularly arround the hot bed of socialism that is Chipping Norton I expect. ;-)

Snowman

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #8 on: 14:08:33, 27/09/15 »
 :)


Don't have to go that far.


I have a circular walk which is actually quite challenging for a South East England walk.   It's 15 miles that starts at Stokenchurch and heads north over several ridges.    Originally I then left the ridges heading East and picked up the Ridgeway.    However the section of the Ridgeway north and south of its crossing with the M40 is frankly a disgrace.   In winter it's a sea of mud and in summer it's like the surface of the moon, with 4x4 tracks 3 feet deep in places.    The problem is that despite signs instruction 4x4s to stay off, they take no notice whatsoever.   This is a National Trail that we advertise to foreign walkers!


So I had to rework the route with a detour further east, however while the OS maps show a number of footpaths the only ones you are likely to find readily open are the ones that are farm tracks, or cross grazing fields.    I'd love to take the Grauniad journalist from the OP around some of these, since with the best will in the world you'd need a herd of elephants to trample down the undergrowth that has been left to run riot.   Even where the path is clear, they leave 'double' stiles with a six foot, nettles up to your armpits filled gap between them to test the mettle of the most ardent walker.


I also had one of those 'worrying' incidents with cattle, i.e. the whole herd took and interest in me and followed me, nudging me as I crossed the field.   There was no alternative other than a huge detour over tarmac so I brazened it out.


As I said previously, what really annoys me is that there is very little we can do about it.    The landowners won't do anything.   The area is a little too rural for the local councils to want to spent time and money, and we simply are no longer allowed to carry the tools to fix it ourselves thanks to some poorly thought out legislation.




pauldawes

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #9 on: 21:14:58, 21/10/15 »
I think state of footpath signs in a given walk is often very suggestive of occupiers attitude to walkers.


If signs are well maintained, and thoughtfully placed to help you at key decision points, then it's likely that walkers are welcome.


But if signs are toppled with direction markers destroyed always assumed walkers not welcome.


 Mind you the bizarre thing is that messing up the signage increases chances of walkers having a darn good trespass...so maybe I should regard obliteration of signage as a welcoming move.

Strider

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #10 on: 00:27:27, 22/10/15 »
Exactly, if you can't see the signs how are you to know?  ;)
Not all those who wander are lost

pauldawes

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Re: Why is there so much anger around country paths?
« Reply #11 on: 06:34:32, 22/10/15 »
Exactly, if you can't see the signs how are you to know?  ;)


On last walk I did only clear path in field led down to a locked gate festooned with barbed wire, and a prominent notice "private keep out".


I knew I was pretty near footpath, so spent 5 mins walking along hedge looking for proper exit...found it well concealed about 30 ft to side of barbed wire gate. And yes...sure enough 100 yards earlier had passed a destroyed direction marker that no doubt had pointed out the correct exit.

 

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