Author Topic: Field Shut off for Hay, even we...........  (Read 1293 times)

Mel

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Re: Field Shut off for Hay, even we...........
« Reply #15 on: 20:34:21, 07/07/19 »
YOU aren't.  The actions of inconsiderate others spoil it for everyone else  :)



No expense spared in pursuit of a bargain ;)
https://snailspacewalks.blogspot.co.uk/

pauldawes

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Re: Field Shut off for Hay, even we...........
« Reply #16 on: 21:12:41, 07/07/19 »
YOU aren't.  The actions of inconsiderate others spoil it for everyone else  :)


But if you agree I wouldn’t be inconsiderate by walking the field...I just walk it..and the actions of the inconsiderate few haven’t spoilt it for me!

No need to worry about me watching farmers clear up poo bags while I walk ROW..I have seen far worse sights.
« Last Edit: 21:19:11, 07/07/19 by pauldawes »

Mel

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Re: Field Shut off for Hay, even we...........
« Reply #17 on: 21:23:08, 07/07/19 »
 :)
No expense spared in pursuit of a bargain ;)
https://snailspacewalks.blogspot.co.uk/

barewirewalker

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Re: Field Shut off for Hay, even we...........
« Reply #18 on: 07:45:31, 08/07/19 »
Coming from a farming background yourself BWW, I would have thought you would have more patience, compassion and understanding about the balance between the many uses and users of our green and pleasant land  O0
Sad day for the agricultural industry, when they need me to fight their battles for them. Surely the NFU represents enough of them to put pressure on the Veterinary Practices and the Pharmaceutical companies to educate dog owners.

Pauldawes hits the nail on the head, like him I do not walk with a dog, dog owners are a peripheral urban problem, not necessarily an access issue. But has the the CLA instigated any research to identify if this problem due to walkers, not pet owners walking their dogs. Has the rural landowner, cashing in on the property market helped exacerbate this issue? Between the pharmaceutical companies, veterinary practices and dog food manufactures there's enough vested interest and marketing potential to find an actual practical solution.

Did I deliberately go trampling through this hayfield to annoy the farmer? Read my posts! I am not blaming the farmer, I was asking where the motivation is coming from that causes the farmer to ignore his responsibilities as a land manager, yet use an agricultural problem as an excuse.

Both DA and Mel have fallen into the trap of appeasement, by not identifying the true culprit. There is an answer here, a perfectly good alternative route. Had the the CLA done their homework, before coming into a membership race with the NFU, we probably would not be having this argument? There are plenty of management techniques that could be used, if only they had been thought out by the bodies that represent farmers and landowners.

Do not forget that this this an area that has escaped being furnished by the RoW dept. of Powys CC, so the true effects of landowner/farmer issue is showing through. 20 or 30 years worth of the CLA trying to establish a grass roots membership, within the agricultural community, without the CLA owning up to the major part their members have played in the past to create this problem in the first place.

I came across this notion of 'shutting off a hayfield', over 10 years ago, when the only knowledge of a Nemotode that can migrate from the stomack into the bloodstream, so that it can infect the liver of a bovine was probably only in the minds of the vets specializing in rare diseases. By that time the landowners were well into the swing of converting country cottages from farm workers abodes to desirable country retreats for an expanding urban population.

dolfor_map_hayfield by Barewirewalker, on Flickr

We parked at a civic center by the school, top right of the map, our route had taken us through the hayfield on the out bound part of the walk, so there was no, indication that we should not walk through it apart from lack of walk furniture.

Hayfield is shaded in green. The obstructions marked are to both the RoW and viable alternatives
« Last Edit: 09:30:11, 08/07/19 by barewirewalker »
BWW
Their Land is in Our Country.

Mel

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Re: Field Shut off for Hay, even we...........
« Reply #19 on: 18:39:03, 08/07/19 »
Dog owners don’t need educating.  They know they should pick up and take home. 
 
I don’t walk with a dog either but I still respect the wishes of a farmer’s temporary path closure sign and understand the reasons why, despite my own frustration of the situation.
 
Nobody said you was blaming the farmer!  I have simply given a farmer’s answer as to why a hay meadow might be closed to the public.  I don’t think they’re being unreasonable, given the explanation.
 
Yes, it’s frustrating for both responsible folks and workers of the land but any rational, normal person will understand and probably empathise.
 
Oh, and you’re only arguing with yourself BWW.  I’m certainly not arguing, (despite yours and PD’s attempts to draw me into one).  My opinion is different to yours.  An argument won’t change that  :)
 
No expense spared in pursuit of a bargain ;)
https://snailspacewalks.blogspot.co.uk/

barewirewalker

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Re: Field Shut off for Hay, even we...........
« Reply #20 on: 11:59:58, 09/07/19 »
Mel, please do not think that I do not value your input. Any alternative view has value in debate as it tests the strength of my arguments. Having had NFU working experience, I think I know where the value of education might improve public behaviour.

I wonder if anyone has really looked at the map I have posted, as walkers if we do not learn to recognize significant features on the map, how can we form opinion on the value of ways.

Here we have a 3.2 acre field with 4 points of entry, which are rights of way, the field has 2 gates, only one that serves a RoW. The field has fairly new stock proofing fencing, yet no provision has been made to recognize the rights of way. Even if the walk furniture has not yet been provided does the fencing obstruct the RoW. We see that farmers are well able to provide simple aid to climb over a fence, where beaters might need to get through for shooting.

Why not provide these simple measures, where a legal obligation in land management is required. I do not think that the reason of 'the field being shut off for hay' is the reason for attempting to detour us away from this field. Perhaps it was more of a guilty conscience. I would have had more respect for this farmer, if he owned up to the fact there was no walk furniture and he had made no provision in his new fencing, also his hedges were overgrown and a fallen tree completed the obstructions.


We were given directions part way to a perfectly good alternative route, but even this was fudged. No admission to the two locked gates with barbed wrapped over their top bars, which gives a further clue to the reading of the CLA's monthly, Land & Business.




BWW
Their Land is in Our Country.

pauldawes

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Re: Field Shut off for Hay, even we...........
« Reply #21 on: 13:51:37, 09/07/19 »
Mel, please do not think that I do not value your input. Any alternative view has value in debate as it tests the strength of my arguments. Having had NFU working experience, I think I know where the value of education might improve public behaviour.

I wonder if anyone has really looked at the map I have posted, as walkers if we do not learn to recognize significant features on the map, how can we form opinion on the value of ways.

Here we have a 3.2 acre field with 4 points of entry, which are rights of way, the field has 2 gates, only one that serves a RoW. The field has fairly new stock proofing fencing, yet no provision has been made to recognize the rights of way. Even if the walk furniture has not yet been provided does the fencing obstruct the RoW. We see that farmers are well able to provide simple aid to climb over a fence, where beaters might need to get through for shooting.

Why not provide these simple measures, where a legal obligation in land management is required. I do not think that the reason of 'the field being shut off for hay' is the reason for attempting to detour us away from this field. Perhaps it was more of a guilty conscience. I would have had more respect for this farmer, if he owned up to the fact there was no walk furniture and he had made no provision in his new fencing, also his hedges were overgrown and a fallen tree completed the obstructions.


We were given directions part way to a perfectly good alternative route, but even this was fudged. No admission to the two locked gates with barbed wrapped over their top bars, which gives a further clue to the reading of the CLA's monthly, Land & Business.


Like you, I enjoyed Mel’s input to this thread. She was right to suggest I was trying to get her to argue a bit more...I was enjoying the cut and thrust.


I also agree with what I see as main thrust of your argument here: that often when walking through a particular farm a number of typical signs send out signal “walkers welcome” or “walkers unwelcome”.


Well maintained stiles, with access to stile made easy, good well maintained footpath signs...all “shout” welcome. Other signs (I mentioned several in an earlier posting) send the opposite message.


I know my own reaction to footpath issues has been driven by my reading of farmers character. The only two times I complained to local ROW officer I was convinced farmer was paid up member of anti- walkers squad.

barewirewalker

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Re: Field Shut off for Hay, even we...........
« Reply #22 on: 21:13:25, 09/07/19 »
Thanks PD, your input is always welcomed as we have similar views on our allowed access to the countryside. I also value Doddy's input, very knowledgeable on the regulations, which is an area my more undisciplined view has difficulties with.

If Joe Brown and Don Whillans, in the 1950's, had not lost patience with the established view that climbing rock harder than the prewar grades, and showing them that climbing Cemetary Gates in full view of their climbing hut at Ynis Etis was possible. We may not have seen climbing so popular that most towns have artificial climbing walls.

Members of this forum go of to the continent to add to their experience of cross country routes, but how many more are there in this country. The choice morsels of countryside are hidden away in private land, those exquisite stretches of quality way have yet to be discovered and sneaky viewpoints that do not rely on overall height can reveal more about our countryside than we are allowed to know.

Perhaps there are greater revelations about out access network yet to be discovered;
dolfor-kerry rw2 by Barewirewalker, on Flickr

Before being bent off course by this land owner, I had seen a lone pine tree on a knoll and if it had been erect, plainly visible from the west.

Landowners only see footpaths as part of their own land and not part of a bigger picture. The third flag from the left is the field, which is a crossroads of historic ways. I wonder if others can see the significance of some of the other marks on the map?

Immediately to the west of the field is the lone pine tree and the next one west is a bridge over the river Severn, one that is not a major road. Going east from this field is Dolfor and the purple line is the Kerry Ridgeway, beyound that is the place I saw a significantly old pine tree in a position that could be seen clearly from the west. It got blown down in gales about 10 years ago.

 
« Last Edit: 10:12:41, 10/07/19 by barewirewalker »
BWW
Their Land is in Our Country.